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Question about Jewish Holidays and "Christian Holidays"

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So I've been reading alot about the Jewish holidays and how Christians should be celebrating them. I'm learning so much and seeing the point convincingly.

 

But one thing strikes me. The Father gave these feasts and holidays and days of remembrance for days that He did not want the people to forget.

 

But there are four things that it seems we should not forget, and the Father gave us nothing for any of them, except one.

 

The first is the coming of God to the earth in the flesh.

 

The second is the death of God on earth, for which He did give us a remembrance...communion. (BTW, do the Jewish Christians observe this? Just curious. I didn't see any mention of it.)

 

The third is the rising of God from death, the conquering of death for all of eternity.

 

The fourth is the birth of His church, the day of Pentecost.

 

So as I've been reading about the roots of Christmas and Easter, I'm not convinced. These things seemed to really have come about on their own. Kind of. So could they not have been given by the Hand of God?

 

I don't know. But I do know that, while I'm more than willing to give up Christmas and Easter with all the secular trappings, I'm so not willing to give up the remembrance that comes with those days. The meditation and reflection of those days of God's personal coming and interaction with man on this earth, for the first time (that we know of) since Genesis (Abraham was the last reading that I know of where it was actually Him coming...tho maybe with Jacob and the angel? Not sure, but they were all during the time of Genesis).

 

And Pentecost? I do not celebrate it, acknowledge it in no way, except if I happen to notice it on a Christian calendar, and then it's just a momentary thought.

 

What are your thoughts on these things? Am I making them bigger than they should be? Have any of you read anything on these things from this perspective?

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Surleen, these are some great questions and thoughts. I will be answering this with a post of my own later today. At the moment I've got a humdinger of a sinus headache and just can't think real clearly. So, I'll be back!!

 

I do want to say this, after several years of going back and forth and studying ... I have made my stand here ... I personally do not think it has to be an 'either or'. Many will not agree with this and of course they have reasons, just as I have mine.

 

This book helped me sooooo much. It's about a homeschooling family just like ours that started investigating the Biblical Holidays and incorporating them into their life. I highly recommend it.

 

You can download about 50 pages if you click that button, completely free.

 

http://biblicalholidays.com/bhoptions.htm

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Stephanie,

 

The link is a very good one. I too, have to respond later, but will check back.

 

I've been busy making a Renassiance wedding dress this week and am on the last bit of trim before I attach the skirts to the bodice. It's been nerve wracking. I HAVE to get it in the mail tomorrow morning.

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Thank you, ladies. smile

 

My word, C4C, you are a talented lady!

 

I hope you feel better soon, Stephanie. I hate sinus headaches. frown

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oh Shurleen, I had this wonderful response a mile long whistling (OK, it wasn't that bad wink ) when my internet froze up on me. Oy!!!

 

I would be happy to share w/ you anything that I know. I am certainly not the expert as I've just been on this path for 1 yr, but I will help in any way that I can.

 

Yes, there is nothing in the bible that says we should not be celebrating His feasts and festivals (I say His because they are God's, and I know we've been taught that they are Jewish, but that is incorrect. And I actively try to change how I say things as words have power.) And yes, they are for us to remember things, and there are prophetic significance to them also.

 

Now, about the 4 things you have listed that we should not forget, where did this list come from? Did it come from God, our Abba, Himself? The reason I ask, is that church tradition has become church doctrine, and while all traditions are not inherrently wrong, just because they are tradition doesn't make them right either. We need to question each and every one of them, compare them to His Word, and see if in fact they are something we should be doing. Because the Father tells us how He wants us to honor and love Him, and I think with all the detail He gave us concerning His feasts and festivals (x month on x day), He would have done the same with Yeshua's birth, if He wanted us to remember it. So that leads me to obviously wonder, should we be honoring it if its not requested of us? Wouldn't we be better off learning to honor Him in the ways that He has requested? Because honoring in a way that has not been requested, really isn't honoring, is it? Its focusing more on our need to do what it is we want to do, instead of loving Him as He asked to be loved... (see, people are people, the Israelites made their mistakes, and here we are thousands of yrs later doing the same thing, doing things our way wink )

 

Now, our congregation did do "communion" though we did not use that word, and right now my mind is a blur, I can't remember what our rabbi called it (my family and I now attend a Messianic congregation). We do this annually, we do not do it weekly or monthly like some congregations do (our Baptist church did it monthly). The rabbi's reason? This is a special occasion, and he didn't want it to become ordinary by doing it regularly. Now, I have not heard of a right or wrong here w/ this, I'm just sharing you what our congregation does and why.

 

We did honor Passover, which was great, but honestly, I was kind of new then and w/ my mind being blown away by so much that I was learning, I honestly can't tell you so much off the top of my head. I'll have to dig out my notebook and get back to you (yes, I take a spiral notebook and take notes, write down the correct translations of verses where my bible is incorrect, history, meanings of names, etc). I know we discussed Yeshua defeating death, but can't give you details right now.

 

Oh, Shavuot (Pentecost) was a blast! We had so much fun! I will say though, that we did not celebrate it as the birth of the church, for you have to remember, people have been gathering and assembling, and honoring and loving, and obeying God for GENERATIONS, long before Shavuot. I will have to check my notes if there is more to that, but off the top of my head, that is what I remember. Oh, we also celebrated the giving of God's Word, to His people, us, and the Ruach descending down upon the people.

 

One thing I've learned is that we really have to take off our church eyes and look at things differently, oftentimes from the Hebraic perspective, as that is who God used to bring us the Word.

 

OK, my opinion here after all the research that I've been doing is that if God wanted us to celebrate Christmas and Easter I think He would have been as clear about them as He was in Lev 23 about His feasts and festivals. If you research Constantine and keep digging (Babylon was a great influence), you will see how pagan they really are, and how God abhors us being adulterous. And if we are to celebrate them, why is there no mention of Paul, or the apostles celebrating them? Wouldn't they know if we were to celebrate them? You would think if they did celebrate them, that it would be mentioned somewhere... but if you research the history of these holidays, you will see they came many, many years after Jesus' death.

 

I was actually reading an interesting study the other day by this Ph.D. and in it he discusses God, and His meeting with people. God met w/ Samuel, and others. I never realized that, you know sometimes you can read something a hundred times and miss an important phrase... I can try to find it if you are interested.

 

I don't think you can ever make too big of a deal in following the Lord in the way that He has asked us, obeying Him is how we show we love Him.

 

Just to throw something out there, quite contrary to what the church teaches nowadays (that the OT is done away w/), please read 2 Timothy 3:14-15

 

14 But you must continue in the things which you have learned and been assured of, knowing from whom you have learned them,

15 and that from childhood you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

 

The reason this knocked my socks off, is see what he's saying, that the scriptures he learned as a child had everything in it he needed to know to come to Jesus and receive salvation!!! As a CHILD. The New Testament had not been written yet!!! Yeshua is the Word made flesh! I always knew that He didn't come to abolish the law (He tells us so Himself), and I always knew that He was the Torah made flesh, but when I see reminders of this in the New Testament, when the church teaches that the Old Testament is old, done away with, I just gasp!

 

Its in our bibles, we just do not see. The veil is coming off my eyes and I'm telling you, its blowing me away.

 

I don't know Shurleen, the more I learn on this path, the more wonderous everything is!

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Originally Posted By: Stephanie
Surleen, these are some great questions and thoughts. I will be answering this with a post of my own later today. At the moment I've got a humdinger of a sinus headache and just can't think real clearly. So, I'll be back!!

I do want to say this, after several years of going back and forth and studying ... I have made my stand here ... I personally do not think it has to be an 'either or'. Many will not agree with this and of course they have reasons, just as I have mine.

This book helped me sooooo much. It's about a homeschooling family just like ours that started investigating the Biblical Holidays and incorporating them into their life. I highly recommend it.

You can download about 50 pages if you click that button, completely free.

http://biblicalholidays.com/bhoptions.htm
hope you feel better soon!

I like Robin's book too.

We each have to research and decide where we start. I tend to be more black and white about some things, this is one of them. But we all go through a process of growth from here to where ever there is for us. My family does x many things, but we are also still learning about x many things. Just like Paul told the gentiles who were leaving their pagan ways and were new believers, here are a few things you need to do now to get started, because he knew as they learned, their hearts would be convicted of more. And that is where I am. As I learn, my heart is being convicted of more.

I do not look at it as "oh bummer, I have to do x", I look at it as "Oh, I get to serve and honor the Lord by doing x." That is just how I look at it.

Hope that headache goes away soon!
bighug

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Thank you, LaBella.

 

And just in case, I do want to tell all of you who answer that I appreciate your giving time to this. If I ask a question or challenge something you say, please read it as coming from a person who loves the Truth and deeply, from her heart, wants to please God. If something reads rude or aggressive, please tell me, but assume that I didn't mean it that way. I just want to get to the bottom of this. And I so appreciate you all taking the time to address this question.

 

Originally Posted By: LaBellaVita

Now, about the 4 things you have listed that we should not forget, where did this list come from? Did it come from God, our Abba, Himself?

 

 

It came from me, one who has been practicing a tradition that is not mentioned in the Bible, but who sees great benefit from the celebrating.

 

Quote:
The reason I ask, is that church tradition has become church doctrine, and while all traditions are not inherrently wrong, just because they are tradition doesn't make them right either. We need to question each and every one of them, compare them to His Word, and see if in fact they are something we should be doing. Because the Father tells us how He wants us to honor and love Him, and I think with all the detail He gave us concerning His feasts and festivals (x month on x day), He would have done the same with Yeshua's birth, if He wanted us to remember it. So that leads me to obviously wonder, should we be honoring it if its not requested of us? Wouldn't we be better off learning to honor Him in the ways that He has requested? Because honoring in a way that has not been requested, really isn't honoring, is it? Its focusing more on our need to do what it is we want to do, instead of loving Him as He asked to be loved... (see, people are people, the Israelites made their mistakes, and here we are thousands of yrs later doing the same thing, doing things our way wink )

 

Point well made and taken. Yes. This is where my struggle is today.

 

Quote:
Now, our congregation did do "communion" though we did not use that word, and right now my mind is a blur, I can't remember what our rabbi called it (my family and I now attend a Messianic congregation). We do this annually, we do not do it weekly or monthly like some congregations do (our Baptist church did it monthly). The rabbi's reason? This is a special occasion, and he didn't want it to become ordinary by doing it regularly. Now, I have not heard of a right or wrong here w/ this, I'm just sharing you what our congregation does and why.

 

Hmmm. But Jesus said to do it whenever we are together. The reason I make a point of this is that if we are to follow all that He said including all the specifics, then that would be across the board, right? Isn't this another way of shaping this remembrance to the convenience of the individual's instead of doing as God said? (Please don't take offense. Please. Sincere question, not challenging you.)

 

 

Quote:

 

Oh, Shavuot (Pentecost) was a blast! We had so much fun! I will say though, that we did not celebrate it as the birth of the church, for you have to remember, people have been gathering and assembling, and honoring and loving, and obeying God for GENERATIONS, long before Shavuot. I will have to check my notes if there is more to that, but off the top of my head, that is what I remember. Oh, we also celebrated the giving of God's Word, to His people, us, and the Ruach descending down upon the people. {/quote]

 

See, this doesn't make sense to me. Up there you said:

 

We need to question each and every one of them, compare them to His Word, and see if in fact they are something we should be doing. Because the Father tells us how He wants us to honor and love Him, and I think with all the detail He gave us concerning His feasts and festivals (x month on x day), He would have done the same with Yeshua's birth,

 

And yet, it was not outlined in the Word for us to celebrate Pentecost or the giving of God's Word or the giving (falling) of the Holy Spirit on His people. So that's kind of the same thing as celebrating His birth and resurrection, isn't it? Or is it?

 

Quote:
One thing I've learned is that we really have to take off our church eyes and look at things differently, oftentimes from the Hebraic perspective, as that is who God used to bring us the Word.

 

I'm trying. Really trying. But I'm such a Gentile. Thoroughly Gentile. frown I can't seem to help it. Is there a place in the New Testament that talks about a Gentile being able to understand the Old Testament from a Hebraic point of view?

 

Quote:
OK, my opinion here after all the research that I've been doing is that if God wanted us to celebrate Christmas and Easter I think He would have been as clear about them as He was in Lev 23 about His feasts and festivals. If you research Constantine and keep digging (Babylon was a great influence), you will see how pagan they really are, and how God abhors us being adulterous. And if we are to celebrate them, why is there no mention of Paul, or the apostles celebrating them? Wouldn't they know if we were to celebrate them? You would think if they did celebrate them, that it would be mentioned somewhere... but if you research the history of these holidays, you will see they came many, many years after Jesus' death.

 

Again, isn't this the same as celebrating the Pentecost, giving of God's Word, and giving us the Holy Spirit?

 

Quote:

 

Just to throw something out there, quite contrary to what the church teaches nowadays (that the OT is done away w/), please read 2 Timothy 3:14-15

 

14 But you must continue in the things which you have learned and been assured of, knowing from whom you have learned them,

15 and that from childhood you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

 

The reason this knocked my socks off, is see what he's saying, that the scriptures he learned as a child had everything in it he needed to know to come to Jesus and receive salvation!!! As a CHILD. The New Testament had not been written yet!!! Yeshua is the Word made flesh! I always knew that He didn't come to abolish the law (He tells us so Himself), and I always knew that He was the Torah made flesh, but when I see reminders of this in the New Testament, when the church teaches that the Old Testament is old, done away with, I just gasp!

 

Its in our bibles, we just do not see. The veil is coming off my eyes and I'm telling you, its blowing me away.

 

I don't know Shurleen, the more I learn on this path, the more wonderous everything is!

 

I want to go to the Word and read this myself. Like you, I find it wondrous. I want to meditate on it. This is remarkable.

 

Thank you, LaBella. Thank you. I so appreciate you taking the time to answer this question. I would be happy to read more if you think of more or want to answer my questions/remarks in this thread.

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I tried to insert my comments but along the way I somehow messed up and w/ my children now awake, don’t have time to figure out how to fix it, so sorry if its confusing!

 

 

 

no offense taken Shurleen, please question everything! I certainly am not perfect! Prove everything I say to your bible!!!!! Ask your questions, do your research, know that you know what you do and why you do it. flowersmilie

 

I will be direct with you and answer your questions to the best of my ability. Please understand, I am not good at tiptoeing and will be as nice and forthright as I can be. Its all said in love, OK? I too love Truth and want to please my Lord. bighug

 

Originally Posted By: Shurleen
Originally Posted By: LaBellaVita

Now, about the 4 things you have listed that we should not forget, where did this list come from? Did it come from God, our Abba, Himself?

 

It came from me, one who has been practicing a tradition that is not mentioned in the Bible, but who sees great benefit from the celebrating.

 

our current church traditions do seem to be meaningful to us, and not to be rude (please understand that, I say this out of love bouquet ) but I again ask, are they meaningful to our Lord? If they are not, then do they truly add value to our spiritual lives? Are they beneficial towards salvation? We might think they are valuable, "they bring me closer to the Lord", but will the Lord look on them in the same way, as adding to our eternal reward? Personally, I thought I loved my Savior, but I realize now that I truly did not know Him as I did not know the Word that He represented in the flesh. Once I dug into the OT, I finally saw Him in His completeness, not just one sided "Love" but in all His sides, He demands respect, obedience, He blesses, He punishes. I did not fear Jesus as He was portrayed to me in my church, but now I do fear my Savior who is loving and strict, Who expects something out of me.

 

Now, there are many traditions that are OK to pursue, if they do not contradict with scripture, and do not detract or distract you from scripture. That is your measure, does Activity X contradict with God's Word? If it does, then we shouldn't be doing it.

 

Yeshua Himself celebrated Hanukah. Is Hanukah a feast or festival that the Lord mandated? Nope, but it was not inherently wrong either. It was a celebration of the Jewish people winning back their temple and the miracle that Adonai blessed them with, by allowing the oil to continue burning. This celebration also does not contradict w/ God's standards (pagan traditions, etc). There are other things that we can do that do not contradict with God's Word, that is one example. Can't think of anymore off the top of my head, and I hear the pitter patter of feet, so I need to finish this up before bambino comes downstairs.

 

So, scripture is our measuring stick.

 

Originally Posted By: Shurleen
Originally Posted By: LaBellaVita
Now, our congregation did do "communion" though we did not use that word, and right now my mind is a blur, I can't remember what our rabbi called it (my family and I now attend a Messianic congregation). We do this annually, we do not do it weekly or monthly like some congregations do (our Baptist church did it monthly). The rabbi's reason? This is a special occasion, and he didn't want it to become ordinary by doing it regularly. Now, I have not heard of a right or wrong here w/ this, I'm just sharing you what our congregation does and why.

 

Hmmm. But Jesus said to do it whenever we are together. The reason I make a point of this is that if we are to follow all that He said including all the specifics, then that would be across the board, right? Isn't this another way of shaping this remembrance to the convenience of the individual's instead of doing as God said? (Please don't take offense. Please. Sincere question, not challenging you.)

 

you are asking the same kinds of questions a friend of mine has had as she's learning about the Hebraic roots of the Christian faith. wink

 

I can ask about this further as I cannot give you a good response here. Honestly, does that mean we'll partake daily as some of us gather daily to learn the Word? I'll ask and find out.

 

One thing I have discussed w/ my friend as she was learning and kept coming back to me, "why aren't you/Jewish/Messianics/x people doing x perfectly?" and I had to respond to her... church goers that I know expect perfect grace to be bestowed upon them, but when someone wants to obey the Lord's commands, they can be picked apart for every little misstep or mistake they make. Where is the grace? We are ALL learning. And yes, its something I work on daily, coming out of the church traditions, and trying to learn the way that my Savior walked does not always come 1st nature to me, but I press on as we are called to be a holy and set apart people, and this is part of the sanctification process. I am not doing everything the Lord has requested of me, but as I grow, I understand more and am convicted of more. It is a process. My family no longer eats pork and shrimp as they are deemed unclean in the bible, but we do not buy our meat at the kosher meat market (yet), but we are looking at doing that. Like I said, it’s a process. You may be convicted in one area before me, but I might be convicted in another area before you. We can discuss it openly, share with each other and grow, or we can nitpick each other. This is where the love and grace that is preached so often in the church needs to show itself as truly being loving and graceful.

 

Torah is love, it gives us the standards that God has set before us in how we are to show that love. If you steal, you are not loving, if you covet, you are not loving...

 

Originally Posted By: Shurleen
Originally Posted By: LaBellaVita
Oh, Shavuot (Pentecost) was a blast! We had so much fun! I will say though, that we did not celebrate it as the birth of the church, for you have to remember, people have been gathering and assembling, and honoring and loving, and obeying God for GENERATIONS, long before Shavuot. I will have to check my notes if there is more to that, but off the top of my head, that is what I remember. Oh, we also celebrated the giving of God's Word, to His people, us, and the Ruach descending down upon the people.

 

See, this doesn't make sense to me. Up there you said:

 

Quote:
We need to question each and every one of them, compare them to His Word, and see if in fact they are something we should be doing. Because the Father tells us how He wants us to honor and love Him, and I think with all the detail He gave us concerning His feasts and festivals (x month on x day), He would have done the same with Yeshua's birth,

 

And yet, it was not outlined in the Word for us to celebrate Pentecost or the giving of God's Word or the giving (falling) of the Holy Spirit on His people. So that's kind of the same thing as celebrating His birth and resurrection, isn't it? Or is it?

 

in Lev 23:9 to around vs 22 you will see God's command for us to count the omer and honor Shavuot. There is nothing wrong with honoring the giving of God's Word! That is His Holy Scripture. I’ll check my notes, maybe it was more reading about the Ruach HaKodesh/Holy Spirit and what happened on that day than celebrating it, but again, I am learning so much I can’t remember it all, that is why I take notes. I’m telling you Shurleen, its like my world has been turned upside down and I’m truly a babe on this walk, so much of what I thought was right, is really wrong, and its not like I am blindly following some man/rabbi/pastor, its there in my bible, I just never knew it. Scripture is there. So my brain overfloweth with new things.

 

Originally Posted By: Shurleen
Originally Posted By: LaBellaVita
One thing I've learned is that we really have to take off our church eyes and look at things differently, oftentimes from the Hebraic perspective, as that is who God used to bring us the Word.

 

I'm trying. Really trying. But I'm such a Gentile. Thoroughly Gentile. frown I can't seem to help it. Is there a place in the New Testament that talks about a Gentile being able to understand the Old Testament from a Hebraic point of view?

 

Shurleen, about understanding the Hebraic perspective, you just dig in and start where you are. The Hebrew language is a language full of verbs, its all about doing, whereas the Greek perspective, which is how we were all raised, is about believing, thinking... we have to understand that our God doesn't expect us to just sit there and have faith, though faith is a component. He expects faithfulness , which is faith lived out, faith in action. Faith without works is dead. Need the doing to go along with the believing.

 

Here is a bible study I've started and am enjoying, it might help you understand the 'doing' vs. just believing:

 

Its Not What You Think, Its What You Do

 

the author discusses what it means to fear the Lord, what it means to hear Him, and both are action words. For example, to hear is not passively sitting there with your eardrums inadvertently hearing something, hearing is to actively listen, and to obey.

 

Anyway, thought this bible study might be a good start for you. Also, if you can get your hands on it, Restoration by Lancaster is a wonderful, gentle introduction to the usefulness of the entirety of God's Word, and understanding the Hebraic mindset. He explains the struggle he had and where he has now come to.

 

Originally Posted By: Shurleen
Originally Posted By: LaBellaVita
OK, my opinion here after all the research that I've been doing is that if God wanted us to celebrate Christmas and Easter I think He would have been as clear about them as He was in Lev 23 about His feasts and festivals. If you research Constantine and keep digging (Babylon was a great influence), you will see how pagan they really are, and how God abhors us being adulterous. And if we are to celebrate them, why is there no mention of Paul, or the apostles celebrating them? Wouldn't they know if we were to celebrate them? You would think if they did celebrate them, that it would be mentioned somewhere... but if you research the history of these holidays, you will see they came many, many years after Jesus' death.

 

Again, isn't this the same as celebrating the Pentecost, giving of God's Word, and giving us the Holy Spirit?
Quote:

 

Just to throw something out there, quite contrary to what the church teaches nowadays (that the OT is done away w/), please read 2 Timothy 3:14-15

 

14 But you must continue in the things which you have learned and been assured of, knowing from whom you have learned them,

15 and that from childhood you have known the Holy Scriptures, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

 

The reason this knocked my socks off, is see what he's saying, that the scriptures he learned as a child had everything in it he needed to know to come to Jesus and receive salvation!!! As a CHILD. The New Testament had not been written yet!!! Yeshua is the Word made flesh! I always knew that He didn't come to abolish the law (He tells us so Himself), and I always knew that He was the Torah made flesh, but when I see reminders of this in the New Testament, when the church teaches that the Old Testament is old, done away with, I just gasp!

 

Its in our bibles, we just do not see. The veil is coming off my eyes and I'm telling you, its blowing me away.

 

I don't know Shurleen, the more I learn on this path, the more wondrous everything is!

 

I want to go to the Word and read this myself. Like you, I find it wondrous. I want to meditate on it. This is remarkable.

 

Thank you, LaBella. Thank you. I so appreciate you taking the time to answer this question. I would be happy to read more if you think of more or want to answer my questions/remarks in this thread. I pray that I said something that was useful to you.

 

 

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LBV,

I tend to agree with you about communion. Part of the traditional Sabbath celebration is breaking of bread and drinking from a cup of wine with Blessings before and after. In the more Orthodox Jewish synagogues, the cup is 'filled to overflowing' as part of their tradition which I find very interesting. If everything else is a 'type' or 'shadow' as a 'marking' point to get our attention of what God is 'really' up to among the Israelites, I have every reason to believe that Communion is part of that 'remembering'. Some Messianic folk are quick to say 'this is not communion, it's a Sabbath breaking of bread'. They'll even use the scripture from John at the Last Supper about 'as often as you do this, do it in remembrance of Me' as referring to 'as often as you have Passover'. Personally, I'm not buying it. I need to be washed in His Blood daily so I take Communion daily just so that I stop my whole day and consider that. And rather than it becoming a stale routine (which is a matter of each individual heart) it affirms something of my forcefully recognizing my total dependence on Him for everything daily. Taking my eyes off of what I 'see' naturally and looking to Him Who IS my refuge. Nuff said about that.

I also think that if we really look carefully at all of the details of a traditional Passover seder, it's so obviously clear about that what that was referring to that I want to SHOUT about it. Every detail of the ceremony just screams YASHUA to me. So much for eating ham (of all things) and fancy dresses and Easter eggs and sweet chocolates for Easter. Try Unleavened bread, horseradish, simple roasted meat and bitter herbs combined with 4 cups of redemption to get a real message. Not to mention the 'broken bread' and 'hidden' Afikomen that is found by a child so that it is thoroughly ingrained in them to 'watch' and seek and look for something that is hidden. Or the idea of leaving a door open and an empty chair for 'Elijah' who is to come. Giving up 'leavened' bread in humility for just one week of eating only unleavened bread just serves to accentuate the great work done at Passover and 'remembering' that with great humility.

Shavuot/Pentecost occurs 50 days (not by accident; 49 + 1) after Passover. It's the day celebrated as the giving of 'teaching' and when the Torah (properly translated as teaching) was given to Moses the first time. How interesting it is that it's the same day that Holy Spirit fell on the disciples in Jerusalem (the Teacher) and they were anointed with fire (wait there as directed).

If there are more questions, I'll be glad to give you my understanding but I think this addresses most of what I read.

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Shurleen,

 

I'm sorry it's taken me so long to get back to you. Life has been a little crazy.

 

I second the website Stephanie recommended. A really great site with lots to learn and solid doctrine.

 

Here are some more websites of a Messianic direction, since that is what you seem to be interested in.

 

FYI, for those that don't know, a Messianic Jew is, in a nutshell, one who practices and observes Judaism but also believes that Jesus (Yeshua) was and is the Messiah.

 

http://www.messianic.com/

 

http://www.messianicliturgy.com/

(This is for those who want to learn the Jewish Prayers and liturgy from a Messianic perspective. The gentleman who does the liturgy is a wonderful man, truly loves God.)

 

http://www.messianictimes.com/

The only Messianic Newspaper, a good site & publication

 

http://www.themessianiccenter.com/

A relatively new site, this site seeks to be a source for all things Messianic in nature.

 

http://www.galileeofthenations.com/

A wonderful source for true Messianic music

 

http://www.bridgesforpeace.com/modules.php?name=News

An outreach to Israel that posts the TRUE happenings

 

Do pm me if you would like to chat more.

 

 

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Thanks. smile

 

I haven't posted, but that doesn't mean I'm dropping this. It just takes a while to read this stuff and take it in so that it makes sense.

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I can't be any real help here as I'm just starting to research this myself but here's a link to some information I ran across. I don't know if its what you're looking for or if it will help you but I thought I'd post it just in case.

http://www.biblestudy.org/basicart/main3.html

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