Mother

4 hours ago, Jeepers said:

It's getting so any more, if you don't grow it, you need to side eye it. 

That is so true even of our American produced foods.  Farmers and producers here are allowed to use chemicals and additives that most other countries have banned and unless there is a complaint, an illness, or one of the random tests shows a problem nothing is done about it.  We could find the same lead or other toxins here as easily or easier than from other countries. 
 

Still another reason for eating as local as possible. 

Can we see pictures of the plant?  And something to give us a size, like a quarter beside the leaf or a ruler?  I’m not sure it IS a clover. 

Euphrasyne.  Those are WONDERFUL,  I am sooooo glad you like to take pictures of your yard.  You should be proud.  Do you follow the Square Foot Garden method for some of those beds?  Do you use the soil mix from that book?  Your plants look so lush.  👍

I, too, have had her on my mind.   I have been .  

I would love to see pictures, Euphrasyne.  I love to see lawns turned into vegetable gardens.  Flowers too.  There is something about a big expanse of bare lawn that seems so sterile.  Vegetables can be beautiful.  I once saw a beautifully landscaped yard in a small town. We stopped to admire it and were invited for a tour.  The owner told us the town required owners had to keep their property ‘neat’. His back yard is all waist high raised beds complete with built in automatic water systems. Some were round but most were eight or ten by four feet. They had mulch walkways between them and were arranged artfully in curved designs. They were full of lush vegetables with edible flowers here and there. Behind that, along an alley, were rows of sweet corn and melons and other vining crops growing on a fence trellis.  One side yard had filled border beds along both the house and the property line with a green lawn of low growing chamomile and other nice sweet smelling herbs. He said he rarely mowed it as it stayed fairly evenly low.  The other side of the house was full of flowers.  It looked like an old English garden and it surrounded one side of a paved eating area with grill and etc set up like an outdoor kitchen. The other side of the patio, close to the back door, had another raised bed full of herbs. The house sat close to the street so the front yard was small but it also contained beds full of flowers.  He told us he raised all the produce his mother and he could use for the year and the neighbors were blessed with the extras.
 

Now I have to tell you in all honesty, the man was a landscaper.  He had all the equipment and wherewithal to set this up but he pointed out that it wasn’t something he did overnight.  He said It took him a few years to get it that way and that most people could do something similar in their own yards. I realllllllly wanted that yard.  We took a ride at least yearly to see his garden but the last time through, after the derecho, we found the storm had hit his yard hard. Several of the raised beds had collapsed, the fence was gone, the plants looked like a giant had trampled them.  I wanted to stop and weep over it all but I figured the owner had enough trouble without finding some crazy woman crying in his yard. I became ill shortly after that and we never went back but someone told me he had rebuilt and replanted.  
 

Still, I am amazed at how many vegetables he could grow in a ‘landscaped’ lawn???  

And that, ladies, is why I live in the country.  Though there ARE county ordinances, we live back in a thousand foot lane where no one sees what we have/do.  We would definitely be in trouble as DH was a ummmmmm collector and has many a piece of equipment setting in the brush on the property, most of it, thankfully hidden as he knows MY ordinances! 

I used a both corded and battery powered electric lawn mowers for years but have to admit I liked the battery one better.  No cord in the way and usually by the time the battery ran down I had too and was ready for a rest. I usually did half the yard at a time.  
 

I would rather have critters mow the yard but if I lived in town I believe I would cut down on the mowing by having more garden beds, either raised or at least defined to look neat.  I know it could be a problem in housing associations but would there be ordinances against that in towns or cites?  

11 hours ago, Littlesister said:

Mother, I would have to take the cabinet above the sink down to do something like that. The sink is right next to my washer and dryer, and unless I tear out the cabinet, I don't think I could do it. But something to look into.

It might still be done only using a bucket with a faucet installed instead of a barrel and it wouldn’t have to be set that high either.  Maybe off to the side or hung from a rafter????  
 

Necie, thanks for the reminder….I have used old windows and bales of straw as make shift cold frames many times with good results.  But you made me think.  I just bought 1/4” mesh vinyl coated hardware cloth to make insect barrier hoops over my deck beds.  I could easily cover them with clear plastic to make cold frames both now and to extend the season in the late fall.   I just received the hardware cloth though and I’m not too sure it won’t shade the plants too much. But….i think we have some old windows like you describe in an outbuilding that just might fit those beds…..IF they are windows and not screens like yours…..
 

But screens are useful too.   

LS, what about a gravity fed barrel to use at the garage sink.  You could have it set up above the sink and hooked right to the faucet.  As the well is outside the garage you could pump it full with the hand pump on the well.  The nice thing about that set up is you could easily drain it if you thought it might freeze.  

Hmmmm,  I have enough trouble keeping my homesteady heart in check over chickens,,,,,now you’ve gone and made me think about goats.  Nice small lovable Nigerian Dwarfs.  Fence in the yard, fence off the garden beds, and let them nibble.  They will love the ‘wild herbs’..   

Momo.    At least you got the doctor’s signature.  I can’t get one without seeing several different doctors and even more tests.  And then a certain number of weeks of pt….  We pay for all scooters and etc.  thank the Lord I have some handy family repairmen.  
 

I totally understand your frustration and depression.  It’s hard, I know but try to hang in there.  Do whatever it takes to get through this. When I’m really down or having a really tough patch I play music or even sing, I read a good book like LS said, or I figure out something to research, not anything related to my problems but something fun and different.  I find short meditations or relaxation tapes to listen to, they really help with the pain and stress.  When I have to be sedentary I make list of the things I am looking forward to doing, I even add a few work things.  Or I ponder a few things I wish I could do and then I put my mind to trying to figure out ways I MIGHT be able to do them from the wheelchair even though I know I won’t.  Lately I have been thinking of chickens.  Not of having them again but about what the coop would have to be like to work from the wheel chair if I DID have them.  You would not believe the impossible ideas I’ve had about that 
 

Momo, what I am trying to say I guess is that even though we are incapacitated we can still live through our thoughts, our dreams, through our memories, good ones that is.  I’m not saying escapism, I am saying working on that new attitude you mention.  You might not be able to change what is happening to you but you can change your attitude to it.  I know, I know, it’s not easy. I fail at it too, but then, after I have a nice pity party I just start over.  
 

We care Momo, 

Necie, rosemary will have to be brought in during your Indiana winters but it usually does well inside too.  Depending on the type of mint, there are a LOT of different ones, it could take over the rosemary,   Some of the smaller mints look real nice with it though, ones like.corsican. I like to grow thyme in with my rosemary, when I have it.  I lost mine to an early freeze a couple years back and will be replacing it this spring. 
 

Jeepers, I have mint and lemon balm in an under-tree bed and neither have escaped even though the bed is only made of deteriorating sawn logs sitting on the ground.  But then, all the herbs that were in there struggled to survive. Probably the tree roots competing for food and water.  It now contains the parsley that comes up from seed each year and a measly sprig or two of sage.  The mint and lemon balm are not even in much of a fight in there. I want to take that bed out to make it easier to mow but as sure as I do the lemon balm and mint will scream for joy. 
 

It is true…. They both can be invasive.  I do love both though.  They both make such wonderful tea.  The lemon balm is super calming and is mild enough to give to children.  I use it dried for tea but I like young leaves in a salad, especially a fruit salad and mint pairs nicely with lemon balm in both those applications. 
 

As to chives…..I have never had regular chives spread beyond nice big beds of it. I let mine flower as the purple flowers look so pretty and the petals are great in salads. The leaves hold their flavor nicely when dehydrated.  I chop mine before drying in the dehydrator and then just sprinkle them on whatever I want.  I love them on hard boiled eggs of any kind, in salads, in soups and casseroles and any where I want a mild onion taste.  Now GARLIC CHIVES are another story.  Oh I love the taste and use them both fresh and dried on all sorts of things…..the plants spread EVERYWHERE.  They produce nice big white flowers that look nice and produce thousands of seeds that only need a speck of ground to grow into more beautifully flowering plants with thousands of seeds that…..  Every time someone mows it smells like …..well garlic.  I’m positive it keeps the vampires from our house as I’ve not seen one here, ever.   On the plus side, besides the obvious uses of garlic chives,  I collect the seeds from those plants I do allow to flower and use them in my sprouting mixtures as they go with lots of different sprouting seeds.  I use them with clover,  alfalfa, and radish seeds for a nice blend. I use the seeds with lamb’s quarter seeds when I have them but haven’t been up to harvesting those wonderful plants for a while. But they go nice with spinach too. 
 

I bet you can tell I love my herbs.  I’m really looking forward to bringing them closer to the house for easier access, even the wild plants if I can get someone to help find them.  

Great harvests, Ambergris.  I, too, hope your move is coming, and soon.  Even so, it’s nice to be able to keep planting.  That way you will have it if the move is delayed and if you don’t get things harvested before the move and you can’t move them, they will be there greet someone else.  

I am sooooo glad you did.  I was just wondering if I could move it to this year but couldn’t find it!!!  Good work MM. 

LS,  I have found the key to regrowing celery is instead of cutting the stalks off to pull off the individual stalks one by one and use them until you get down to where you have only a small center green area that is growing from the larger root end.  Then put  it in only after deep enough to cover the root end.  When tiny little roots start to form plant it in soil.    Keep it consistently damp (celery likes moisture) and give ot plenty of time to start growing. It is slow producing but once it does it seems to be robust. I still have a producing plant from early this winter. The leaves are starting to yellow but I believe if I feed it or transplant it that would soon green up.

We already have some great posts in the Challenge 2023 thread so be sure to check them out but I’m starting a new one for this year so we can look back and see what we did this year. Not to mention that Necie asked me to.  Thanks for the reminder   
 

The original thread started as more of a self challenge to see what and how much you can grow close to your house or in containers and etc.  I still encourage that for everyone as it is what might be necessary in a SHTF situation to keep your food supply safe.  But those of you with bigger gardens (or unusual ones like Midnightmom) need to be challenged too.  Do not hesitate to share those with us here also.  Tell us your plans, show us your pictures, and share your successes and your failures so we can all learn and be encouraged. 
 

I love my raised beds, deck boxes, container garden.  In some ways they need more tending though.  You need to pay careful attention to water and fertilizer and the soil needs to be added to each year. Raised beds that sit directly in the ground are not so needy as to water as they draw moisture from the ground but containers almost always need to be watered and amended at some point.  I buy red worms each year for my containers and feed them by mulching around plants and tucking compostable matter beneath the mulch or in the soil. I find I don’t have to add fertilizer with them but they don’t live through our winters here. If they did I believe they would build the soil in the beds.  

Many of you have read my accounts of regrowing vegetables.  I have done some of it for years, usually in water.  Last spring I purposely put root ends and tops of all sorts of edibles in my deck beds as an experiment to see how well each thing did.  Most of what you get when regrowing something are greens or herbs.  Some things go to seed very quickly unless the greens are kept closely picked.  I found the tastiest leaves were the new ones as they came on.  I did not have one day during the entire season and up until winter hit full time that I did not have greens available.  I even had leeks green and usable in the snow.  
 

I did, however, meet with varying success.  Sometimes a root would take hold and grow, sometimes it would just die and rot.  The rotting ones were not wasted though, I mostly just dug those deeper into the soil and let them become feed for the other plants. Some plants surprised me, like celery.  I never can get it to grow from seed but most of those root ends gave me big beautiful o plants of cutting celery. The stems weren’t thick like store bought is but their taste was excellent and the leaves were so bright and green and tender. I used them often in place of lettuce in a salad or I dried them for seasoning, even lettuce regrew well.  The Romain and the small butter head types better than the iceberg.  
 

One thing I found about lettuce this winter is that if I could find the small heads you can buy in special clamshells with their roots intact, I could keep them fresh in the refrigerator, in their plastic containers with their roots in a small bit of water, for weeks.  Plus they would continue to grow, albeit slowly.  But when I tried to move them to the greenhouse they died within days. They obviously like the cold so I plan to put one I have saved back out in the deck bed as soon as the weather stays above freezing at night.  
 

Now you might say I still had to buy those veggies to begin with and that is partially true.  Some of those veggies came from free tables or were given to me by others who knew of my project.  Plus, even if boughten each of those veggies provided me not only with the intended part but also fresh greens from something that might have just been tossed out or composted and each leftover after those bonus greens, went to make compost also. And sometimes even seeds.
 

it has been a profitable and fun endeavor.  I plan to focus on replacing and building up my medicinal herbs this year but I will dedicate at least one deck bed to just regrowing and might even tuck a root here and there among the herbs. 
 

Now I want to share a picture of a big rutabaga.  I have not had as good of luck with regrowing them as I have other veggies, I thought because they are almost always waxed to store better.  When my DD found this huge (waxed) one on a free table ten days or so ago near where she works she brought it to me. Why it was there while the weather is still freezing out is beyond me but she knows how well I like them. It did have a store sticker on it so I’m guessing the grocery there chose a nice day to put out some produce to help the needy.   When she brought it I let it set in the table instead of refrigerating them as I usually do as the refrigerator as full. This is what it is doing. 
 

LS, have you tried Premie nipples yet?  Sometimes they work because they are softer.  

Happy birthday, Momo.  I’m so sorry your day was not great.  Perhaps tomorrow will be lot better.  

I am sorry to hear she has passed away. In looking at her profile I see her last post seems to be 2014.  Has it really been that long? She was the voice of reason for food safety.  Having taken a few extension office food safety classes I understood the need for being careful and paid attention to what she said.  Thankfully her voice will live on through her posts.  
 

Something we might all think about. As long as Mrs S is here and accessible to others, our own voices will live on through our posts.  It makes me even more aware of the need to be careful of my words.
 

Remember though, new info comes along from all over the world, more ways to do things come to light, and more accurate testing is possible compared to even ten years ago when Violet was with us. We need to be open to different ideas, be they antiquated or futuristic but we need to use good judgement in assessing those ideas.  Some things we learn on Mrs S we would perhaps not use now but we might need that info in the desperate times we prepare for. 
 

RIP Violet. 

I am beginning to plan my gardens, not nearly as ambitious as yours, Necie. Or even as in the past.  Mostly container gardening this year.  My focus will be on herbs mainly. I am replacing/restocking my medicinal herb garden and have plans to move wild herbs closer to the house for easier harvesting.  I will be putting in some vegetables. Probably mostly for fresh eating, tomatoes , peppers, cukes, a zucchini or two and some snow or sugar pod peas.  I had such good luck with planting the ends and tops of veggies last year and this winter that I’ll continue to do that for greens. If let grow most of them will flower and seed but the fresh greens are really good. I’ve been cutting celery inside all winter from the root end of one celery plant. It’s more like cutting celery than regular but just as good tasting and free. I’ve cut three or four meals from a bok choy root growing in the top of the aquarium but it finally decided to flower.  
 

6 hours ago, Ambergris said:

One of the people bottling meat (pork, as I recall) crammed it in and/or used a lot of fatty bits in various segments,

This makes sense when you couple it with keeping it in the refrigerator. This would be similar to the old fashioned ‘larding’ that is still used in places where home butchering is prominent.  In the past, freshly butchered meat was fried until well done, then layered with lard in big crocks and stored in the unheated cellar.  Before consuming the meat was refried again or boiled well.  Cooking that meat with fatty pieces, three days in a row and then refrigerating, could give you a similar product. The fat would come to the top and seal the meat as well as the lid used. 
 

Thinking this through I believe I’d need more proof too or I’d use it only as a last resort if new lids were no longer available, like in a SHTF situation. 

I’m not advocating this method.  It seems risky to me but I do know that a Lot of countries use traditional preservation methods and have a lot less food poisoning from all sectors than we have here.  Most of these methods are for their local produce though and might be different in this country.  I would want some info on honsafe, in general, this is.
 

Actually, there is very little food poisoning from home canned foods in this country than from commercial products so we must be doing something right.  I, personally would err on the safe side.   Some of what I’m reading about it says it’s not as effective as an autoclave but then, neither is our canners.  It does seem this method is purposely allowing the spores to grow so they can turn into the bacteria so in turn be killed in subsequent boiling.  
 

It might be something we could use for sanitation or sterilization purposes in a survival situation though. That’s why I said it was interesting . 

We have tried the frozen root vegetables that are meant to be roasted.  Pic Sweet brand I believe???  Some have parsnips in the mix, some beets but mostly they are sweet potato, winter squash, regular potatoes, and carrots.  They are pricey unless on sale but we like them and they are easy to dump on a sheet pan and roast with a little olive oil.  I routinely freeze root veggies though. I partially cook or steam them before hand as that makes them faster to prepare. I freeze winter squash, sweet potatoes, turnips, rutabagas, beets, parsnips, and etc.  I don’t think they freeze as long as other veggies but they are a quick addition to a meal without the work at that time.   I usually prep extra fresh roots when I do cook them and put them in the freezer but I have been known to take a couple hours and do a bigger freeze session.  I’ve even started to cut them in smaller sizes and make up my own sheet pan veggies for the freezer.  Much cheaper. 
 

That said, root veggies keep months in the refrigerator and I prefer them over the frozen ones.  Plus, if we lose electricity they will still keep a long time unlike the frozen ones.