Can we please review what we *can't* can?

[bluegrassmom]

I know that a few years ago I had always heard that you were never supposed to can corn. Then we did that post where we all showed our kitchens and I saw row after row of canned corn in Darlene's kitchen and learned differently.

 

I have also heard that you're not supposed to can potatoes, but found a lady tonight in blogdom that cans them 100 pounds at a time.

 

I know we're not supposed to can butter or pumpkin butter. (Really not trying to start anything with that statement. I know there are some strong feelings on both sides of that argument.) Also know about not doing pasta.

 

So can we please get a list of what we should not can?

[Cat]

*anything with dairy products... including milk, cream, butter, and cheese.

 

*pasta, rice, and noodles (including "rivels" and dumplings)

 

*eggs

 

*avocados

 

*oily stuff or oil

 

*breads for long-term storage

 

*thick purees of potatoes, sweet potatoes, squash, etc.

(make them uniform slices or chunks)

 

*soft summer squashes

[Why is canning summer squash or zucchini not recommended?

Recommendations for canning summer squashes, including zucchini, that appeared in former editions of So Easy to Preserve have been withdrawn due to uncertainty about the determination of processing times. Squashes are low-acid vegetables and require pressure canning for a known period of time that will destroy the bacteria that cause botulism. Documentation for the previous processing times cannot be found, and reports that are available do not support the old process. Slices or cubes of cooked summer squash will get quite soft and pack tightly into the jars. The amount of squash filled into a jar will affect the heating pattern in that jar. It is best to freeze or pickle summer squashes, but they may also be dried.]

<a href="http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/questions/FAQ_canning.html#24" target="_blank">http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/questions/FAQ_canning.html#24</a>

 

<a href="http://www.uwex.edu/ces/cty/outagamie/flp/documents/06foodcreativityIvory.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.uwex.edu/ces/cty/outagamie/flp/...tivityIvory.pdf</a>

 

<a href="http://extension.usu.edu/files/foodpubs/foodsaf7.pdf" target="_blank">http://extension.usu.edu/files/foodpubs/foodsaf7.pdf</a>

 

 

(More to come from others and me...)

 

 

 

 

[Leah]

Question?

That first link states:

"Any fat that gets on the rim of the canning jar can prevent an airtight seal. Excess fat in jars makes it easier for the fat to climb the sides of the jar and contaminate the seal."

-

I'm finding basically those same 2 sentences all over the 'net - nothing about spoilage, just the grease climbing the sides preventing a solid seal...

Is that why we're not supposed to can fats and oils?

My Grandmother used to store pints and halfpints of fat from all kinds of animals down in the root cellar...From my reading I'm thinking she didn't actually can it, but used the jars to store it.

[westbrook]

pasta and rice fall apart! I wish I knew how other companies were able to can pasta and rice!!!

[Violet]

The starches also include flour, tapioca, and no barley, either. Starches change the density, also the ph of a food. Flour has a very high ph level.

This is why you don't can fats/butter/oil.The fats surround particles of food, allowing botulism to even survive pressure canning. I know there are a few tested recipes that allow for adding oil to saute in, but those recipes are highly tested for safe preservation. That, and a few HIGHLY acidified marinated pickled items. Again, not all foods can be processed in that manner.

No bacon added to green beans for above reason.

Some foods protect the botulism spores differently than others.

No thickening of tomato product before canning, not salsas, not ketchup, etc. not even with Clear Jel.

Clear jel is only approved for canning pie fillings or jams. It is because they are high acid foods, not low acid or borderline acidic foods.

The canned breads and cakes are not safe even for short storage. They should never be sealed. Only made and put in the fridge for a few days or frozen. The seal will create the anerobic condition in which botulism grows.

No canning of pickled eggs. I know someone said eggs, but this include pickled eggs.

Potatoes must be peeled before canning. The peel harbors the botulism spores since they were in the dirt. No amount of scrubbing can insure it is gone. It is the stuff you can't see that can grow.

That is all I can think of to add right now.

 

[bluegrassmom]

Ok, now I'm confused.

 

Originally Posted By: Violet

This is why you don't can fats/butter/oil.The fats surround particles of food, allowing botulism to even survive pressure canning.

 

The first time I ever canned my dear meat, after it sealed and cooled, I ended up with a layer of fat that had come to the top of the jars. I came here and asked if that was normal and was told that it was. We've always eaten it (I just spoon that layer off and use the meat) and it's always done fine. Or were you talking about adding in extra fats? Because what I had was just fat from the meat, not anything extra added in.

 

 

[JCK88]

I am wondering if it is safe to can butternut squash soup. (my recipe contains no dairy and uses turkey broth)...but then it's easy to can just the squash in chunks and the broth in jars of their own, and to combine them later with spices and add dairy if desired. So that's what I do so I know each thing is safe...but it would be nice to can just the soup all made!

[Violet]

The soup should be canned in chunks, like regular canned winter squash, then puree after opening.

It is the adding of additional fats/butter/oil that is unsafe. Also, plain butter is not safe to can. If it were, it would need a pressure canner since the ph is very high. I contacted Elizabeth Andress about the butter. She said it was not safe.

She is the lady who wrote the USDA canning guidelines.

As for the venison, there will be some fat, but they also tell you to remove excess fat prior to canning. I know some cook the meat, then put in the fridge, remove the fat layer. Then heat to boiling point again, put in the jars and process.

It is safe to can using these guidelines :

http://web1.msue.msu.edu/imp/mod01/01600849.html

[Cat]

Thank you *SO* much, Violet!!!

 

I'm so glad to know we can count on your good sense advice and instruction. So many of us do what we've "always done" and it's not ALWAYS the safest and smartest thing to do.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[JCK88]

Thanks Violet...I sorta figured that. So that's why I can the squash and the broth individually--it's not that hard to toss them together and add spices afterwards. But when I do this, I also have to sautee some onions first. That's okay, too:)

 

I wish the Ball Blue book was more clear about this kind of thing. Hmmmm...we should make up a list of questions that we have and send them to that company so they can address this more clearly in their literature! I'm an experienced canner and yet I have learned new things here. Thanks everyone.

[Darlene]

bump

 

[Hawthorn]

Thanks for this!

 

I for one wasn't aware that you couldn't can Butter or cheese. I wanted to do that, since they aren't available to buy over here.

[cleanheart]

Okay, I say this with fear and trembling...

 

cause there is about 1000 year experience reading these comments, but I lived among an Amish community in OH and learned a lot from them about putting food by, even have a lot of their recipes they canned, and one of them that I canned for Y2K was called Mock Cheez Wiz. Canned about 40 pints of it and used it up in 2000 and 2001. It was great and didn't make any of the fam. sick. I'm just saying, I don't know what I'm saying. I'm just saying that I've seen it done, not canning straight butter mind you, but canning some things that have milk products in it, like the Mock Cheez Wiz, Blueberry Pie Filling, Apple Pie Filling that has Clear-Jell in it. We canned brown rice in quart jars, and it turned out great. When we wanted to use rice, we just opened a jar and it's ready to use.

 

I don't know, I'm just adding what I've seen done and what I've done myself threw learning from the Amish.

 

Learning from the Best, y'all....

 

cleanheart

 

[Violet]

Cleanheart, I know the Amish have done things that are not safety tested for a long time. It only takes one time with botulism and you could be dead.... If you follow the USDA guidelines that are safety tested then you can be totally sure the food you can is safe.

There are pie filling recipes using Clear Jel that are safe to follow. It is low acid foods, like any soups, tomato products, etc. that are unsafe to thicken before canning, even with Clear Jel.

http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/how/can_02/canpie.html

On here, Darlene only allows USDA tested methods and recipes. I am thankful for her stance on this.

 

 

[cleanheart]

Voilet, All I can say is WELL SAID and I KNOW YOU ARE RIGHT!! One time is too many, and the USDA guidelines are very important and should be followed.

 

Voilet, I appreciate all the insight you have posted about canning the safe and proper way. I have learn a lot from reading them. There is nothing more important than the health of our families in preparing safe, good food for them.

 

When in doubt, don't. the USDA guidelines should always be our standard for canning safely. And I'm glad Darlene upholds to high standards here on MrsS.

 

cleanheart

 

 

 

 

[Jeepers]

My MIL used to can that way too. She would can quarts of green beans in a waterbath canner for 3 hours. Why? Because she didn't know any better. I suppose it is that way with the Amish too. Eons ago they didn't have pressure canners. So, they just do it the way their mothers, grandmothers and great grandmothers did. Also, the Amish are very slow to change the way they do things.

 

If there is a better safer way to store food I'm all for it. That means I'm not going to throw a hand full of barley into my veggie soup because Darlene and Violet said, "NO!"

[Hawthorn]

A quick question for you. I make my bolognaise sauce adding oats to bulk it out. Would this be safe to can?

[GinnyB]

This is just to satisfy my curiosity. It seems that some of the things we can't can safely are foods that have been specifically tested - or at least I believe a report on one or two items. Testing is done by universities or a government agency, correct? I am wondering if some items are "banned"from canning only because testing has yet to be done and that perhaps,if the testing were undertaken, a safe way to can some of these foods would be found? All a matter of money, I suppose...

 

Thanks, Ginny

P.S. Boy, would I like to find a safe Cheese Whiz or butter!

[Darlene]

Hawthorn, unfortunately, no...it would be considered along the lines of pasta, flours, grains, etc. You can always add it later when you open the jar to heat up.

 

And Ginny? I have no inside information but maybe Violet might have some insight as she works at the County Extension Office and might be privy to more details.

 

Hopefully, as time goes on they may discover more things that can be safely homecanned...I'm sure you're talking about dairy products and/or flour/grain, etc products. The reasons they state what they do however bear out factually, scientifically.

[Hawthorn]

Ok, thanks Darlene

[anna]

I have purchased from Extension Service or downloaded off the Internet from Extension Service web sites all canning information and made my own canning book. I slide the printed sheets into plastic page protectors. And use a 4" 3-ring binder. I also have older canning recipes that I've taken to the Extension Service to find out if they were safe in my binder. All canning information was updated around 1989 after exhaustive re-testing by the Extension Service so any instructions or recipes you use should be from after that date.

 

I also have Extension Service information on freezing, dehydrating and storing foods in the same notebook. I have the Ball Blue Book for quick reference.

 

For information on something so vital it really is better to go directly to the source. Google for your state's Extension Service and if you can't find the informtion you want, try another state. You can also visit your local Extension Office and ask for bulletins which are usually around 50¢ to $1 which is why I try to get them online for free!

[Darlene]

Just as a reminder, here's the National Center for Home Food Preservation's website:

 

http://www.uga.edu/nchfp/how/can_home.html

[Lissalue]

Sorry if this is clearly stated somewhere and I am just missing it, but what about corn startch?

[Amishway Homesteaders]

Originally Posted By: Jeepers

I suppose it is that way with the Amish too. Eons ago they didn't have pressure canners. So, they just do it the way their mothers, grandmothers and great grandmothers did. Also, the Amish are very slow to change the way they do things.

Please post a list of all the Amish that have died from canning this way?

Thanks

[Darlene]

AH...please.

 

I know that y'all are very bonded to them, and I hold great respect for them. Let's not take this off to a side road and harbor any personal feelings.

 

The canning guidelines are scientifically proven to be safe for a reason. Whoever decides to do it differently (whether it be Amish or otherwise) is taking unnecessary risks.