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RusticOkie

Would you turn someone away?

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I heard the dreaded "I'm coming to your house" comment today.

 

What would you do in a situation like that? These are people that are not prepared at all for any emergency/disaster, not even for 48 hours. I think the odds of them actually showing up here are slim but you never know. My family is also unprepared for :smiley_shitfan: What would I do then? I doubt I could turn away my immediate family but then again they KNOW that we prep, I've talked to them about it and nothing. My mom keeps a full pantry but thats just to keep from shopping often. My sister has nothing. 1 flashlight and a couple of extra cans of formula for her boys. :shakinghead:

 

The friends that made the comment have nothing prepared, think preparing is silly and so my immediate reaction is to say forget them. BUT they have kids and I know I would have a hard time turning their kids away. What then? They have no marketable skills that would be beneficial either. Sigh.

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This is such a hard topic when it comes up. I've learned over the years that you can't help everybody or fix everybodies problems....not that I haven't tried...it's just not possible. I don't really say much about prepping to anyone outside of my immediate family. There arecertain family who will always be welcome....some have helped us out big time over the years...and I'd love to repay them.

I'd have a hard time turning away children because it really bugs me when they are hurt because of the bad/ignorant behaviors of the adults in their lives. However, reality is that you can't take care of all the children out their either.

And I'm not willing to overtax my families' resources either. So I guess I have my limitations too. Hope none of us have to be in that situation ever.

 

There is a letter out there that you can give to others stating what they can contribute (with goods, skills,labor). I've seen it on the site in the past. Anyone remember it?

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How about this?

 

 

In the Event of a Disaster, the Following is Provided So You Will Know What is Expected of You Should You Decide to Come to My House

 

 

YOU WILL NEED TO BRING:

 

 

1. CLOTHING - Nothing fancy - just good, sturdy, easy care clothes. We will probably have to wash by hand and dry on a line, so plan accordingly. There will be no dry cleaning available. Also, bring rain gear.

 

 

2. PLAIN BLEACH AND OTHER CLEANERS - Plain bleach will be used in water purification as well as general cleaning. More people mean more cleaning to keep a healthy environment.

 

 

3. FOOD - No explanation needed. Bring all that you have or can bring.

 

 

4. BEDDING OR SLEEPING BAG - I have floor space - not bed space.

 

 

5. WEAPONS, AMMO, FISHING GEAR - There will come a time when we will have to hunt and fish for our food. Weapons and ammo will be locked up for safety.

 

 

6. PRESCRIPTION MEDICINE(S), FIRST AID SUPPLIES - You will need your medicines even in the aftermath of a disaster. Be sure to bring plenty because it may be a long time before you get more. Bring all first aid supplies even if it is just a box of band aids.

 

 

7. PAPER TOWELS, TOILET PAPER, TRASH BAGS - No explanation needed.

 

 

8. SOAP, SHAMPOO, TOOTHPASTE, ETC. - You will need to keep yourself clean.

 

 

9. BOARD GAMES, CARDS, A BOOK OR TWO - These will be used during a little downtime before bed or during any other free time that may come available. There may not be any electricity, so don’t plan on just watching movies or using a computer.

 

 

10. ANYTHING ELSE YOU CAN THINK OF TO HELP MAKE LIFE AFTER [A] DISASTER A LITTLE MORE ENJOYABLE.

 

 

PLEASE NOTE: EVERYTHING EXCEPT CLOTHING, BEDDING AND PRESCRIPTIONS WILL GO INTO HOUSE STORES FOR EVERYONE’S USE.

 

 

YOU WILL BE EXPECTED TO WORK FOR THE HOUSE EACH DAY. THE FOLLOWING LIST IS TO GIVE YOU AN IDEA OF WHAT WILL BE EXPECTED OF EACH PERSON. THE WORK INVOLVED WILL DEPEND ON THE NEEDS OF THE HOUSE.

 

 

1. DAILY CHORES - These will include, but not be limited to, cooking the meals and cleaning up afterward, washing clothes and hanging out to dry, sweeping the floors, cleaning the bathrooms.

 

 

2. HUNTING AND FISHING, AS NEEDED - This will also include cleaning the kill or catch, filleting as needed, and preparing for cooking. The hides will also have to be scraped, salted, and stretched to tan. Sewn together, even small hides can be used to make clothes.

 

 

3. GARDENING, AS SEASON ALLOWS - This will include, but not be limited to, starting seeds inside in late winter, tilling ground, planting outside, weeding, watering, and harvesting. We will can or dry any extra vegetables should the crop be good.

 

 

4. HAUL WATER AND PURIFY IT - The nearest lake is a long way off. The water will need to be purified before it can be used.

 

 

5. CHOP OR GATHER FIREWOOD - When the propane runs out, or to supplement it to make it last longer, we’ll cook outside on an open fire, weather permitting. We will have to heat our water this way for washing dishes, general cleaning, bathing, etc.

 

 

AND ANY OTHER TASK REQUIRED TO HELP THE HOUSE SURVIVE.

 

 

REMEMBER - NO WORK - NO EAT - NO EXCEPTIONS!!

 

 

THIS IS SURVIVAL - NOT CLUB MED!”

 

 

 

:wormie2:

John

 

 

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Has anyone ever pursued this conversation at the time that it's been said. Sometimes with a joke or sarcasm. Sometimes with an all-too-superior attitude of "well see, I'm so smart I have all the bases covered. If I'm right, I'm certainly not wasting MY time/money/energy stocking up. But if you're right, I'll just come here and all will still be well.... :curtsey:

 

 

So what happens if we look at these relatives or "friends" and say something like: How is it that you can be so sarcastic about my foresight now and think to rob my children of the food I have scrimped and saved for later? How can you even call me your friend [or sister, cousin....] if you are disrespectful of me and my family to that extent. Do you even see how vile your attitude towards me is? I am appalled by your intent to greatly reduce my resources. Have I EVER told you that I would be by to empty your monetary savings account because I didn't make the choice to fill up a savings account of my own? Yet you think to boldly claim my savings account of food and other neccessities without a second thought? ........

 

 

I think some bold but calm TRUTH-SPEAKING needs to follow that particularly offensive statement. Be prepared to look them in the eye and call a spade a spade.

 

 

 

Or...you could just ask quietly....very quietly, if they plan to kill you first.

 

 

 

 

Theft is not funny. Unless you have invited them to share what is YOURS [and there ARE situations in which any of us might choose to do that!], it will be intentional and premeditated THEFT!

 

 

 

MtRider :shakinghead:

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HI WORMIE!! Glad to see you posting. I've always loved that REALITY list for the unintended 'guests'.

 

MtRider :wave:

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You're right, Mt_Rider, it is theft and disrespectful of anyone to think they should be allowed to march in and "share" what you have worked so hard for.

 

Remember, when God sent the flood, it was too late for anyone to "go to Mr. Noah's house"! God shut the door. The people outside had 120 yrs to prepare, same as Noah did. They squandered their chance. How do you think Mrs Noah felt about her sister's babies dying out there in the rain? Yes, we who prepared may find ourselves wishing we could save all the children, and maybe we can save a few, but those with parents who should have prepared for them are their parents' responsibility. I expect there will be orphans enough to go around. Let's plan on helping as many of those as we can and let the ones with parents, be taken care of by their parents. Just remember that your first responsibility is to your own dependents.

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the husband and I have actually discussed printing out something like that above and giving it to his family. They don't prep and every time I have brought up the conversation, I get brushed aside. My family has prepped a little bit, but I don't think they have more than two weeks supply of food, they definitely do not have that much water (not for my lack of trying), and no weapons. So in the back in my head, I always try to think about having enough for our families. Or at least both sets of parents. I'm not sure his siblings would be much help, or mine for that matter. None of them prep.

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That is a tough question. Most of our friends that live nearby are pretty self-sufficient, so I would love to have them join us. Although I'm pretty sure most of them would stay where they are.

 

On the other hand my in-laws, have no food preps. I'd guess they'd last a week, and that might be stretching it a bit. But, most of them hunt, and my MIL is a good gardener. I try to prep some for them too. But since they live about 40miles away, plus they'd have to cross a river to get here I don't think they'd show up. Unless we were able to give them a heads up to come here somehow.

 

I like the Noah example. I think it would be really hard, but you do have to think about your family first. DH and I don't have any dependents, so our main prepping is for my parents, grandmothers, and young siblings since we all live on the family farm.

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While I have mentioned in the past that my husband comes from a large family of sheeple, I have discovered that there are a few in the family that do prep to a certain degree. I also have (what I believe to be) come up with an acceptable strategy for spurring a few others to prep. I've started rolling it out little by little...

 

The first thing that I had to do was identify a series of events were actually plausible to the relatives. I chose Sudden unemployment, Rising cost of goods, Hurricane Katrina, the Labor Day Storm that we had in the late 90's (no power in the city for over a week!), The Japan Quake, the recent train derailment several weeks ago, and 9/11.

 

Hurricane Katrina played out on tv, so everyone got to see how devastating it could be. In particular to black people. This was quite important because in order to believe that something bad could happen, you sometimes have to be able to see that it can happen to someone who looks like you. Additionally, the government response was so abyssmal that it made it clear that you could not count on them for timely assistance.

 

The Labor Day Storm was unexpected when it occurred and all of my inlaws were around to experience it. It affected most of us personally by cutting power for more than a week and curtailing travel within the city. If you didn't already have food and other supplies, then there was really no place to go to get them. We also had the national guard patrolling the streets at night to maintain order.

 

The Japan Quake was a good choice because we have been getting quakes in recent years and people are getting a bit nervous. The extent of the damage in Japan and the media's touting of the GO bag has been helpful in making folks a bit more aware. The fact that it caused a meltdown of nuclear reactors makes it a scary scenario. We do have a nuclear power plant about 50 or 60 miles away.

 

The recent train derailment near our house was another scary scenario because it happened a few weeks ago. At the time, I fielded calls from relatives and started an impromptu phone chain to get the word out and get everyone prepared to leave if need be. The threat of an explosion and fire so close to our homes was unexpected to folks that never thought about the train tracks being a threat to our lives.

 

And then there is 9/11... The scariest event to have happened on US soil since Pearl Harbor...Enough said. Unemployement...Enough said...Rising cost of goods...You guessed it! Enough said.

 

The next step (which we are currently on) is to actually get more of them to prep. Ideally, I'd like for them all to do it but that isn't gonna happen. However, for each one that starts to prep, it increases the family security level as a whole. As an example... I got my stepdaughter to start. She is terrified of losing her job and she has 5 children. This relieves me of the burden of having to fully prep for her. I will always have things on hand for her in case of a bad scenario, but a tremendous weight has been lifted. I can now turn some of my attention and preps to my stepson. He has a wife and one child.

 

My older daughter moved out over the summer. She is a budding prepper and can easily bike or walk to our house. She has quite a few supplies in her apartment and can take care of herself or transport a few things to our house. Her room mate would probably come along, but that means that there is another person to help transport goods, too.

 

A niece (with 5 children and a hubby) has also started prepping...more for biblical reasons than for anything else. This means that I no longer have to worry about her mom (SIL) and sister (niece). I know that she will be prepping for them. Her brother and wife also prep to a point. I'm not entirely sure as to how much they are doing, but they did plant a garden and move to a more rural locale. I believe that they are prepping full-force, but I will not ask. I do drop hints from time to time and have heard/seen certain things that would indicate that they are taking other steps.

 

The train derailment got my BIL interested in "stocking up" and being prepared for emergencies. He has a disabled son and was concerned about having everything together in case we had to evacuate. The news reports kept talking about how people had been evacuated and then had to be escorted bck to their homes to gather up needed medications, etc... My nephew is on meds and his life could be threatened if he had to go without them. BIL has a small deep freezer and tries to stock up on sale priced foods when he can. He went through extended unemployment and knows that the food budget is one that can be flexed when money is tight. Again, this means that there are 3 more people that I don't have to worry about and possibly more... because he will not turn away a relative in need.

With each new prepper, the burden becomes less and less... I posted awhile back that in a :smiley_shitfan: situation, there was the potential for more than 100 people to come knocking at my door seeking shelter. The numbers are still daunting, but not nearly as bad as they were before. I am now turning my attention to another SIL. If I can get her to start prepping, then that will reduce the family horde down to 50 or so.

 

Having the series of events as a frame of reference means that I can tailor my pitch to each one based upon their fears. I don't want to fear monger but the truth is that some catastrophic event has happened every couple of years. Those events may not have affected everyone, but most have affected someone that we've known. These are not people that I can talk to about an EMP or the New Madrid fault,, but I can talk to them about unemployment, Hurricane Katrina, the cost of groceries or how tough it was getting through more than a week without power.

Edited by themartianchick

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It heartens me to see you have been able to reach out to your relatives, TMC, that is excellent. I have taught myself some hard lessons this past year and my income is tight especially with copays but I still will try to look after myself. It takes some serious readjustment. Part of my difficulty is I require a very good diet... funny how that is so healing also and keeps me more capable of dealing with all else that comes along. I tend to prep mostly with dehydrated and portable items. Or shelf stable.

The only immediate person in case of a big emergency is my neighbor who I know far too well for my own tastes but he is part of mha clients also and would need help to get to a place 45 miles away, if he had to walk, he needs water and food and a pan to cook it in..... a great use for an old pan and big spoon in the bag of dry foods I can fix up for him I think. In fact I can make a carry bag for him since he is not the sort to use a day pack , out of the heavy muslin I have. ( Plain enough to not really attract attention I believe). He can make a bedroll of his blankets. I should put in some plastic garbage bags and an emergency blanket and poncho but he has enough clothes for whatever weather it might be in. Hopefully he would just take the bus if it isn't an emergency that stops that service but I would provide enough for a few days.

All my relatives are thousands of miles away and on their own. I worry about my father out in Southern California in his trailer / campground situation but he keeps about 3 mos. of canned food in his trailer at least and would eat up the perishables as fast as possible. He has places he can go to that are far enough out, if he can get away safely from the cities, and people there he knows in the campgrounds that are good friends, but I also know he feels he is near the end of his life anyway and had quietly told me he was watching things with all the bad politics, I think he feels very sick about how things have turned out and deep down understands how devastating it has become but also feels somewhat powerless as he is not young anymore.

I do think I will tell him about honeyville grains and maybe he would order some soy tvp and beans and rice in bulk too, that would help him and maybe figure out some other distinct needs. He may have room for storing those and they would help him stretch things. Tell him how to make tortillas so he has something to wrap it up with, if he must cook over a fire later , get a big metal sheet to use as well as a fire grill if he doesn't have one already. But one can never say much to him about such things. He might surprise me but if chaos results, I do not think his survivability matters much to him at this point. He is mostly just trying to enjoy himself now, feeling he has lived his life well already and its enough.

As to my brothers, well, they are just trying to get by. They also are either in California or maybe the oil pipeline project areas and thats too far away to get to each other. M is a survivor though, so who knows. A fighter.

K is not. But he has two young adult daughters so they would do what they could for each other I am sure. We do not communicate.

 

As for my son and his wife......they are living the high life, also military and thinking they only have to keep at their usual work to provide currently.... even though her parents went through Katrina in Houston area. Her parents, especially her mom is 'fast food' mentality. They bought a lot of food for the holiday I went to there last year and the year before but other than that they really didn't have anything enough for more than a week. They have quite a bit in income but it just won't be devoted to any long emergency and they are not set up even for an evacuation. AS it was they got stuck in their zone and had to weather the Hurricane where they were because all the other zones went first and they were clogging the roads. They will not do their own homework, so they are unprepared.

My son does do cooking and barbequeing but has been exposed to some of the LDS food storage, unfortunately it wasn't much of a variety so he thinks little of it, yet a good friend still kept her 5 kids fed through a year of bad economic and unemployment times. I wish he would put his thinking cap on. He may not get his professor job in the future and even so, when commerce and transportation come to a halt, there is nothing coming into local store shelves. I do not think he kept his backpacking gear either, but maybe they have camping gear still. I will have to ask. In case of evacuation, one should have that stuff! I cannot have a frank discussion with him, he is too elite in his thinking now. I wish he would 'get it' , it doesn't matter in several of these scenarios if you have money in the bank! Its been a frustration to me because I know they could afford to prep and if they are thinking of having a little one, they need to prep for a young infant or child. They would certainly use it up anyway once they had the child, but at least they would have it to use in case goes further 'south' with our economy. They should have enough to bring stuff and food with them if they have to do a local evacuation due to something like a toxic train derailment of sweeping fire or a tornado swarm.... and I cannot even find out as he balks and is snide about any such thinking and won't talk about it with me if I bring such thinking up. So, they are on their own.

I am so far away, I am not able to be a source of help in a big emergency and will be busy with local conditions here , whatever they could be at the time.

All I can do is pray for each of them as I work to CYA myself and hope we recconnect later! If not... pray for their souls and go on with my own life, as they would want me to.

As for endtimes stuff, it looks exactly like those descriptions in the Bible going on. So that also requires prepping of a spiritual sort as well. And no I don't expect to be caught up before the tribulation period like some may. I believe in the oil in the lamp part though.

I have some local friends who work at their own version of prepping and those people I Know who don't will not be staying with me. Like my neighbor, most of them are foolish or have bad tudes and not the sort I would get along with so I don't want them around me or knowing what I have. If things turned bad I would just be a target. I also know if things shut down I would have a month or so left here and would have to devote time to fixing a place outside in the woods. I am trying to find a way to find out what is still private property on the ways out of town, so I could find some state land that would have water on it and sufficient cover and woods , to avoid private property so that I would not get chased off as easily were I to be discovered... however there is a surveyor in town...... I have to figure out a way to get a look at his maps, lol.

 

I hope this stuff doesn't get too much worse before Spring next year but it could. So I face that, mentally and go through practicing in my head what to do in case anything that might happen, happens, so I can act more quickly to set up something.

 

Yes, the quakes here bother me alot, this building tooks some hits this year and the foundation is poorly. So even that could cause a big emergency for me.

Edited by arby

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.Yup.

 

And most of them without a qualm. I don't think this makes me some kind of monster, just someone who realises the load that I can or can't take on. I've been in work situations where I've heard the comment " If the worst comes to the worst we're coming to your house". I usually answer that one with "Well, that's what the weapon trainings for".

 

I did, work with one couple with young children who made that comment. Because I knew the children I sat down that night and wrote a 3 page guide to making an easy start to prepping including joining Mrs S. Last I heard they'd not had time to read it, but were going on another cruise this winter :banghead: So why bother.

 

As my wife says " All the signs are out there for anyone to read. People are intelligent enough to see them, we manage to. If people won't heed them that's their decision."

 

Don't kill yourself trying to do for those who wont do for themselves.

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My extended family live too far away to get to me in a SHTF situation. Frankly, I'm glad. So I guess it's easy for me to say I'd not have a problem turning any of them away. I do want my son with me and just finished his BOB so he can get here on foot if needed. I would take in my D-Ex. Both son and ex would be an asset with their know-how and physical strength.

 

I had a cousin (RIP) who used to kid about comimg here. I told her to sit tight cause the government would swoop in and save her. She knew I would have taken her in gladly but with her would have come her DH, DD, SIL and GD. No way. I wouldn't take in any of my friends because of who all they would want to bring along with them.

 

I love, love, love the Noah's Ark reference! I am going to use that one. Along with the story of Joseph's grain storage. And Wormie's list too!

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I had a friend over at my house for canning and she say our pantry. She laughed and said tht she knew where she was coming. I told her, OK, but bring all the food you guys are storing, clothes, medicines and weapons/ammo and be prepared to work each and every day to help us all make a "go" of it. She looked at me a bit suprised, but has since started prepping. She does have some gardening and canning skills, she can sew, and her husband is in security, so could help with such issues here. I know that it would be difficult for my husband and I to make it on our own and we have 3 kids. So, as long as she is somewhat prepped and prepared to work, she can be a help in a SHTF situation. (We are still far from being prepped too, but have been working on it for the past 2 years...)

Edited by nini2033a

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MAGs (mutual assistance groups) are great if you can find prepping buddies who will actually prep with you. Too many say they are prepping, but actually never seriously do anything.

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I only have 2 relative in this state, my father who is a long time prepper and my brother, who is one, although my SIL is a little skeptical. I have sent her books (passport to survival, dare to prepare, and making the most of basics) which are the best I have found for beginners, after she asked me rather timidly if I was a prepper (actually, she asked if I thought the world was going to end too...I told her not exactly, but I prepped for everything from economic emergencies to nuclear war). Hopefully she is coming on board too. My other sibs live in other states but are also preppers due to parental training in our youths. Fortunately, my neighbors are also pretty self sufficient, but I am feeling them out slowly as to their mind-sets and whether they would be interested in a MAG since they all have useful skills and tools. I am already blessed with a prepper house-mate who is a vet and pretty doggone handy all round.

Edited by kappydell

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I know it wasn't worst case scenario, but we have already not supported non-prepped persons. After a hurricane someone called wanting to know if we knew where they were passing out mre's and when food stamps/unemployment benefits would be available. They also said they were low on gas and didn't have water. DH wouldn't let me help because he knew their prepping had consisted of buying party food instead of necessaties. I'm not sure he'd respond differently in a :smiley_shitfan: situation.

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I should have added, this type of thinking by others concerns me. I'm afraid of how desparate people might get and what they would do. I'm not sure how well my community would come together. :unsure: I'm afraid there would be an "I don't have anything, aren't doing anything to help myself, don't want to help myself, so you have give me yours" mentality, at least among enough people to make things worse than they already would be.

 

 

I should also add DH isn't heartless. He is wanted to make sure we had enough since it was the day after the hurricane and we didn't know if any stores would be able to be open because the power was out and didn't know how long it would take to get it back.

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Windmorn, you have a smart husband. I don't think it is heartless to be concerned that your prepping benefit your family rather than someone who could have prepped but didn't bother.

 

I remember once while we were in a mobile home park, my neighbor's water lines froze and burst. While she was getting it repaired, I loaned her several jugs of water I kept under the sink and refilled them for her several times. When the repairs were done, she had not bothered to return the jugs, I had to go to her home and ask for them so I could refill them and put them under my sink again. She gave them to me, but asked "why do you keep jugs of water under the sink?" It seemed to me to be self evident why I did that and it also seemed to me that a semi-sensible person would learn a lesson and do likewise, but it just never clicked with her.

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No, I wouldn't turn them away no matter how unprepared they were or how little we had left. But, that's me. :happy0203:

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I have tried for years to get my family and friends to prep for hard time or emergencies. The result is that I am the object of every joke told. I shut my mouth, saying nothing more on the subject.

 

I learned my lesson. I have moved 600 miles and other then my parents, no one knows my address. NO ONE here knows I am a prepper. My neighbors actually feel sorry for me since I am a Northern City Girl transplanted into the South and I try hard to live up to being the "Clueless Northerner" . My neighbor doesn't "prep", but her way of life is to keep a full pantry and have emergency supplies. We lose power very often and our homes are all electric, which means no running water along with power. My immediate neighbors are prepared, even if they don't think so.

 

Now friends or family make the comment "I'm coming to your house" my reply is simple... "Can't you get shot in a driveway closer to home?". I think that gets the message out that no one with the exception of my parents, is welcome SHTF.

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I've been reading through someof the older threads and came across this:

http://mrssurvival.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=6390

 

I thought it might be something to think about.

 

I haven't responded directly to the current thread yet, because honestly, I don't know how I'll react. I know, I know, I should mentally prepare myself, but frankly, there are so many variables.

 

In the end, whether we're talking MBZ's, a severe economic depression, and/or a devastating natural event, I think the only way we can survive is through developing community with those who live around us. No man is an island. And no matter how thoroughly you think you've prepped, you are going to need to reach out to others, if only to receive news.

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So you'd give them false hope that you could provide for them and yourselves and all starve together? Or do you have some plan, whereby you and however many come will go to the woods to gather twigs and bark and trap rats and somehow you'd survive?

 

No time here for "feel good" but unrealistic thoughts, hon. Best to face the facts and make up your mind what you are going to do.

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Each person must decide for their own peace of mind. Don't feel "put down"... each of us have our own way of expressing ourselves, and it's *different*.

 

 

I'd love to say I've "decided". But I lean towards Homesteader's thoughts... I'm not sure I could turn away a truly desperate family who come in peace, not with guns drawn. But there are people who I know spend money foolishly and act like the foolish "grasshopper" of the story. They live for today with no thought of tomorrow. Not many even know how to truly cook.

 

Unfortunately, my grandson's parents keep very little on hand. Yup, my own daughter. Last winter they were fortunate that Mom had stored some extra food in their "forgotten" cupboard when 1) they got sick, 2) then they had a snow storm, and 3) then their car broke down. I put a case of bottled water and a wind-up lantern in the basement of their new house after they moved in. Already they have been without power for several days when a storm blew through. And still they don't keep extras on hand. :(

 

Think it through, prepare, but don't obsess on it and drive yourself crazy. Not one of us really know what we will do in any given situation until it's there.

 

:bighug2:

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As much as it pains me to say, I 100% agree with CGA, Mt and Wormie. We now live on the edge to build a BOL, supplies and train in skills. We actually forgo some nice things, nice times that others have as a normal thing in their lives. Someone thinking they can come along in their shiny new car with the latest designer clothes on their backs, have another thing coming.

Someone can either invest time, energy, work and/or cash into building our safe place or be prepared to get turned out.

The hard way if needs must.

 

I know a few good people here who if they would find themselves in Europe when the midden hits, they'd be welcome. Some overhere in this country as well cos of their skills.

Those that opted the fancy life and 3 holidays a year can take a long walk back. They are not taking away the survival opportunities I worked myself half to death for and risk my family.

If anyone goes hungry, it's those that laughed at me for being so worried and prep like some idiot.

 

Oof, sensitive point here.

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