CrabGrassAcres

That's a relief, Mt Rider. I was dreading having the girls kid on the trail. Let's see, my Nubian had a doeling and a buckling. My FF LaMancha had twin doelings. My Sr LaMancha had twin doelings again too. (Might as well get what I want, LOL) So I have 5 doelings in a cage on the poultry wagon. My 2 Holstein steer calves are 2 months old, weaned and can walk with the rest of the livestock. I just tossed the aluminum step ladder on the back of the wagon. We ladies have to be able to climb in there, right? I think on the last pass thru the mts, we can probably drain the water tank and that will lighten the load. Once it is empty, some other freight can be put inside the tank.

Gathering up all the pvc pipe and the shallow well/cistern pump and putting them on the wagon. I keep finding stuff! LOL

A vargo would be nice! I'm thinking we will live in the wagon till we have a cabin up. I'm throwing in all the sandbags (empty) I have 2000, plus a bunch of plastic feed bags. ( I have these in case of needing a quick shelter from a nuke event.) They can be filled and stacked for an earthbag building. I'll have to toss in some barbed wire to go between courses.

Yes on the starts of asparagus, fruits and garlic! I'll bring some onion starts. I have plenty of OP seeds, including cukes. Thanks for reminding about the traps. I'll bring mine too. I have one, that is very heavy duty. On sharing, my thoughts are that people being what they are, it is best if all things are not held in common. However, when first starting out on something like this, it is good if people can be generous with one another but don't obligate others to share unless they wish.

Everybody that can, should add some fencing wire to their loads. Yes, you can build wooden fences after we get "there" but that takes time and energy and we will all be busy making homes and gardens and barns. There is a reason that people use so much fencing wire. It really saves time and energy because you aren't cutting so many trees and you don't have to designate someone to be keeping the herds where you want them. A good fence and LGDs make it possible to let the stock graze while the people are doing more constructive jobs.

I have a lovely European Scythe, Mt Rider. I'll put it in. You should probably have one too, though. Be sure to get extra blades. I want 3 teams of oxen too! My sister needs 3 teams for each of her three wagons. She has 5 drivers in her family, though the teens will probably swap out driving and herding on horseback. I like the idea of a separate wagon for poultry. It should be lightweight so can probably use one horse for it and let one of the neices drive it. The cattle panels weigh about 20-25# each. I figured 4 for each wagon under the canvas and the rest over the canvas so they can be lifted off as needed. Three wagons can handle all of them. The canned foods are heavy, however, they are already cooked so will save on fuel and cooking time. I expect they will be used up fairly rapidly shared among so many people. Remember that your calorie needs are going to go way up with this vigorous lifestyle. We will not want our crew to have poor energy or health due to lack of feeding. I'm figuring 500# for clothing, blankets and yard goods. Another 500# for kitchen/laundry/tools. 500# of tposts. 175# (for each wagon) cattle panels. 500# fencing/cage materials, window glass and screen. 300# people. (Driver and passenger, since daughter has to ride most of the way.) 2000 pounds livestock feed. (5 barrels) 6000 pounds food and seed. Before we leave, we are going to hit both feed stores in my sister's town! My goats are due to freshen Feb 28, March 2, March 12. The other two aren't bred yet, but I expect to freshen in May and June. If the goats are fed properly, they will probably continue to milk, though maybe not as much as if they were hanging out in the pasture all day. I am concerned about them freshening while we are traveling. The poultry will lay for the first week or two, then may take a break till after they are in their new homes for a few weeks. Glad you are taking the Cotton Patch and Embdens Mt Rider. I'm going to take as many turkeys as I can. I have 4 breeds. I'll bring American Buffs and American Blues in the geese.

Who changed the weight limit? When? I missed that!

I'm bringing lye and coconut oil for soap as well as rendered lard. Also have several pounds of castile soap made up that I'm bringing. I've never made goat milk soap, I'd rather use the milk for cheese or drinking. Will we have the luxury of using goat milk for soap anymore? I'm also bringing 3 top flight bird nets, 25x50' each for the tops of poultry runs. Can I fasten a bunch of barrels to the outside of the wagons? I was doing some figuring and 12,000 pounds is 30 barrels that weigh 400 pounds each. I can't fit that many IN the wagon (only have 20, but I have a lot of grains and stuff in totes.) If I can fasten some of the barrels outside, I can put totes inside. (Busily taking stuff out and putting it in. GONNA make it fit!) LOL ETA Hey Stephanie, are you having your homeschooling class figuring out weights and how much you are putting on the wagons? Mt Rider, I have a 1500 gallon cistern for the water wagon. Full it weighs 12,000 pounds.

I have 25 cattle panels I want to bring. They are 4' tall by 16' long. I figured I can bend them over the top of wagons and fasten them to the sides. That still allows plenty of room above my barrels for lightweight stuff. If we distrubute them on my wagon and my sister's two they will be available at night or for longer stretches to make corrals for livestock. My sister also has a round pen. I'll bring some tposts as well and some rolls of fencing that I have. Might as well bring a solar charged electric fence too. I'm going to put the jars of canned goods in the barrels of grains. As the jars empty they can be washed and repacked in the barrels with grain inside and around them. I figured the space left can be filled with grain from another barrel until that barrel is empty. Then the empty one can be used for a water barrel if needed or other items can be put in it for safekeeping.

Heading over to my sister's farm and having them help move the livestock over there. No way to mount a gaurd here with only one adult. Daughter is not able to help at all. Where is this train jumping off from?

I decided to sign up my sister and her family. 2 adults and 3 teenagers. So they get 2 wagons pulled by oxen. They are bringing their flock of Nubian goats, herd of Dexter cattle, 6 horses, 1 Great Pyr, 2 cats, 1 rat terrier and a pair of African Grey Parrots (which they really should leave at home, but can't tell them anything. LOL) They have some long guns and he reloads. He does carpentery (not for a living though). She home schools and is into Nourishing Traditions. They are just starting to do some prepping but I have set aside grains and beans etc for them and they can load those on their wagons along with all the livestock feed that they have on hand. They have turkeys and chickens and regular guineas and ducks that they can bring. Not sure what all she has for kitchen, but she collects old fashioned kitchen stuff and can bring all that. Their teens can help with driving wagons and herding animals. I think they would be an assest to the train. Guess I'm loaded except I need to go pick up those Angora goats. Just found some, about 10 miles from me in the town where my sister lives. I'll get a buck and three does.

Oh my, you are hurrying us, aren't you! I'm bringing the lavender guineas. I have 5 so I can bring all of them. 3 females and 2 males. I don't have any African Greys. Would you like the trio of Cotton Patch? Or perhaps a trio of Embdens or American Buffs? Turkeys can indeed be herded, as can geese and ducks. Probably wouldn't want to be held back to a goose or duck pace though. A dog crate is a good size, one of the big wire ones. I won't have time to dry all my meat if we are leaving so soon. Maybe I'll have to split the jars between everybody and we'll just eat them as we go.

Oh good, I was hoping some more children and young adults would be coming! I'm adding rolls of window screening and cage wire and some panes of window glass.

I'm not sure about taking canning jars of food. Maybe I should try to dry the contents? I have 20 good metal barrels with tight lids. I think I'll pack most of my stuff in those. If anybody needs additional poultry, I have more than I can take with me. I'd be glad to have some of you folks take breeding groups of chickens, turkeys, geese and ducks. The birds would be yours so you'd need to provide feed and such. I think I should take 2 yolk of oxen. I want a couple of saddle horses too. If I'm going to live primative, I should get over being afraid to ride. Anybody taking cows should just have them bred first. Some are sure to have bull calves and that would take care of breeding later. I might try to get a couple of Angora goats too, before we leave.

Arby, if you want, you can take my treadle sewing machine. It has all kinds of attachments and does lots of neat stuff. I don't sew much any more, so I could just come visit when I want to sew something. I don't think you'd ever be able to use yours again. I also have some extra grains you can take on your wagon.

.Firegirl, check with Stephanie, I think she has a Nubian buck. I'm bringing an Alpine buck, so you probably don't need a buck, just does.

Participants: Crabby and dear daughter Skills: Animal care, gardening, herbal lore, midwifery, rough carpentry, nursing, canning, drying food, nutrition, butchering animals, hatching birds and raising them, teaching, music, sewing, knitting, crochet, weaving, quilting, painting. Animals 5 does, 1 buck (dairy goats, my buck is an Alpine) 4 Great Pyrenees LGDs Trio of geese Trio of turkeys 6 chicken hens and 2 roosters Trio of guineas Trio of ducks Pair of piglets? The goats can walk, as can the dogs. The birds will have to go in crates. For the animals, I'll need some buckets and feed pans. About 400# of grains for animals. My wagon will be pulled by a pair of oxen. Kitchen: Wonder Jr Grain Mill Big Berkey water filter and extra candles. Cast iron meat grinder Cast iron spider, cast iron dutch oven on legs with flat lid for baking, cast iron pot (5 gallons) for washing and making soap or whatever you need a big pot for. (I don’t own these, but hope to.) I do have several large cast iron skillets. 6 tin plates, 6 spoons, 6 forks, 6 knives, 6 tin cups Set of nesting stainless steel pots with lids Large metal bowl for making bread. Cast iron bread pans, 4. Long handled metal spoon, spatula, tongs, ladle. Set of kitchen knives and sharpener. Folding table and 2 folding chairs. All American Pressure canner Extra lids, rings and jars. Stainless steel coffee pot Stainless steel kettle Food: Grains Beans Flour Sugar Salt Dried veggies and fruits Spices Lard Dried meat Hard Tack Portable soup Chocolate Coffee beans Tea Powdered Milk Water Health Sanitation: 5 pounds activated charcoal assortment of herbs Several large bottles of benedryl, Tylenol, aspirin, motrin, multi vitamins, vitamin c, vitamin d, etc. Several gallon jugs of cod liver oil. Collection of fish antibiotics First aid trunk (not going to list contents, but it is large and comprehensive.) Soap, alcohol, betadine, vinegar, turpentine. Pine salve. Cayenne pepper. Laundry Two galvanized tin washtubs, scrub board and hand operated wringer. Gardening: Shovel, hoe head, rake head, plow head. Seeds. (Including fruit tree seeds.) Clothing: In a chest, 2 pairs sturdy shoes each and 2 pairs stout boots each. Extra soles and shoe nails and leather working tools. Socks, 12 pair each. 6 pair cotton and 6 pair wool. 6 skirts each, 3 gingham or muslin and 3 wool 6 shirtwaists each, 3 summer and 3 winter 1 light coat and 1 heavy coat each 2 warm shawls each 1 raincoat each (oil cloth) 2 warm sweaters each 2 good sunbonnets each 1 good Sunday hat each 12 pairs long legged underdrawers each 2 sets wool longjohns each 6 sturdy bras each (I ain't wearing no corsets and that's that!) 2 summer and 2 winter petticoats each 2 linen nightgowns and 2 wool nightgowns each 2 night caps each 2 pairs wool mittens each 2 pairs work gloves each 2 pairs mens denim overalls each (cause sometimes a skirt just ain't gonna do) Several bolts of material. Thread, yarn, buttons, pins, needles. Tools: Treadle sewing machine (I have a nice one and it will be really good to have.) Ax, hammers, hand saws, files, planes, splitting wedge, drill brace and bits, chisels, screwdrivers, cat’s claw, crow bar, pliers, bolt cutters, Metal stove pipe for the clay stove I’m making when I get “there”. Iron griddle for the top of my stove. Screws, nails, nuts and bolts and washers. Rope. Lots of rope. Tie wire, different gauges. Lighting: 6 lanterns, 6 Aladdins, extra wicks, mantles, chimneys and lamp oil. 50 pounds candle wax. Wick thread. Shelter: Tarps, (I need a tent, maybe a canvas wall tent) All my warm blankets and quilts. Canvas ground cloth 2 folding cots Protection and hunting: 12 gauge shotgun 22 lr rifle .303 British Enfield rifle .22 lr hand gun .38 special snub nose revolver Ammo for above and reloading supplies and equipment. Books: Bible, song books, concordance, Bible dictionary, as many of my extensive collection of how too books as possible.

The Project Gutenberg EBook of The Oregon Trail, by Francis Parkman, Jr http://www.gutenberg.org/files/1015/1015-h/1015-h.htm Y'all might find this interesting. I haven't started packing yet. Had to have a new computer. LOL

My old computer was dying so I stopped at a second hand and found a really nice one for $100! Should do me for quite some time.

After I cut all the meat I could off a front leg from my sow I butchered, I cut the leg into three pieces at the joints. Cleaned off the foot real well and boiled it to bits. Took off the rest of the meat and put it back in the pot with navy beans, whole green peas, lentils and yellow split peas, when those were done I added dried onions, dried celery, dried mixed bell peppers and parboiled rice. I seasoned with salt and a little bit of jerky marinade. This is good and I could probably eat it a couple times a month. I made a huge pot so I'll have to freeze some for later or can it. Prob just freeze it.

Alexis, just use the mylar in the bucket. You don't need to do the extra work or expense of making smaller bags too. Do get the O2 absorbers and put them in the buckets. Should be good for 20-30 yrs if you start with fresh beans and corn. The shortening doesn't last as long and should be rotated every yr or two if at all possible unless stored in a freezer. If kept frozen it can be kept a good 10 yrs or so. If it accidentally gets thawed it can be refrozen with no problem.

I assume that most people are going to have pots already. You do need a grinder, like a corona. You should try to get a pressure cooker if fuel is a problem. If you heat with wood, just cook on the heating stove. Otherwise, you can use twigs or even a solar cooker.

Rechecking prices Pinto beans 50# $24.86 now 25.43 Jan 19 2008 Field corn #50 8.50 6.50 Shortening 18.68 22.49 So while corn has gone up, beans and shortning are actually less. Buy one container liq shortening $18.68, 2 bags of beans $49.72, 6 bags of corn $51.00, Total 119.40 .

Terrible disease. I was 3 when the vaccine came out. My best friend's MIL got it and she was pg with BF's husband. It stunted him, he is smaller than anybody in the family. His mom did ok for a long time then started having trouble again.