Midnightmom Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 What is happening in America? Now the White House wants everyone to rat out their friends and Internet contacts if they don't happen to agree with everything the President says about the biggest socialist scheme in American history! Linda Douglass, communications director for the White House Health Reform Office, is asking Americans to watch their personal emails -- even "casual conversation" -- in order to INFORM THE WHITE HOUSE OF ANYTHING "FISHY" being said about ObamaCare! Here's the quote: Since we can't keep track of all of [the disinformation] here at the White House, we're asking for your help. If you get an email or see something on the web about health insurance reform that seems fishy, send it to flag@whitehouse.gov. Link to comment
gramma lois Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 What a load!! Well I guess President Obama garnered so much support via the net for his campaign that now his people think they can just use this same tool to turn neighbor against neighbor? What a crock!! Link to comment
Cricket Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 Obama's methods are not new. We older folks have seen it before... http://www.americanthinker.com/printpage/?...informants.html August 05, 2009 Citizen Informants By Bart Willruth In 1930's Germany, the new socialist government of Adolf Hitler (NAZI National Socialist Workers' Party) began indoctrinating children in the quasi-military organization, the Hitler Youth, to inform on their parents should they overhear discussions subversive to the policies of the Leader. As the noose was tightened, local community organizers were appointed to watch their neighbors and were told to report subversive comments to the bureaucrats above them. Neighbors informed on neighbors, some for reasons of patriotism or loyalty, some from fear. A modern inquisition ensued; a terror to free thought and expression. Increasingly harsh penalties were meted out to those who dared to dissent. The socialist governments of the Soviet Union, Fascist Italy, N. Korea, Cuba, Yugoslavia, and the People's Republic of China employed the same citizen informer techniques. Citizens of those societies were reduced to either silence or whispered discussion only among those they trusted the most. Of course none of those things would ever occur here in the land of the free. But wait... Now on the White House website posted by Macon Phillips comes an eerily similar request for citizens to inform on their neighbors. It states, "There is a lot of disinformation about health insurance reform out there, spanning from control of personal finances to the end of life care. These rumors often travel just below the surface via chain emails or through casual conversation. Since we can't keep track of all of them here at the White House, we're asking for your help. If you get an email or see something on the web about health insurance reform that seems fishy, send it to flag@whitehouse.gov." Read this again carefully. The government of the United States is openly asking citizens to report rumors, the contents of casual conversation, and the contents of emails. They decry the fact that they are unable to "keep track" of the communication between citizens effectively and are asking for help from informers. Of course forwarded emails would contain the electronic addresses of the sender. Does this sound like the country you know (knew)? Are these the words of people who think of themselves as public servants, or is this something darker? Does a constitutional government tasked with protecting the rights of its citizens ask them to inform on each other to the White House? Are we now like one of those totalitarian states? No. But we have become more collectivist. Is the move toward appointing unaccountable Czars with enormous authority, the takeover of multiple industries (corporatism), the restructuring of the economy on a socialist-command model, and the request for citizens to inform on their fellows a step closer to that ugly place? Unquestionably, the answer has to be yes. We must be concerned with the direction in which we are headed as well as the breathtaking speed. Forty years ago, a philosopher named Leonard Peikoff wrote a book (still in print) called The Ominous Parallels. In it he shows the parallels (then scarcely noticeable) between the rise of Hitler's socialism and the trends in the United States. At the time, the book could have been dismissed as the ranting of an over-zealous, though erudite and articulate, conspiracy nut. In retrospect, Peikoff appears to have been quite prescient. Reading it today, it appears like a roadmap of the last half century and how we got to this point. The implications are clear. If the direction of the nation and the philosophic perspective of the populace isn't brought back to the founding principles, the end point is predetermined. Unfortunately, the premises underlying the agenda are shared by both major parties. The opposition party is neutered in that it has accepted the premises of the socialists, a strategy doomed to failure. My father and several uncles risked their lives in World War II to bring down the socialist threat of the German and Italian Axis powers. They survived. Many of their buddies were maimed or killed in that struggle. That generation successfully destroyed the military threat, but their efforts were blunted by the persistence of the altruist-collectivist philosophical virus which animated those socialists and which has infected the USA. Aside from the anti-Semitism of that time, both Western Europe and the USA are thoroughly imbued with the language and programs of the National Socialist program including its major platforms of National Health care, National Retirement benefits, National business plans, National agricultural plans, social safety nets, politically correct expression expectations, national ministers or Czars who answer only to the Leader, and the endless "we" talk so characteristic of collectivist societies. Our forebears sacrificed so much to pass on the blessings of liberty. The least that we can do in the shadow of those heroes is to exercise our right to speak, and to do so out loud, not in whispers fearing that someone will forward our thoughts to the Watchers. These intimidating tactics must end. Contact Bart Willruth. Link to comment
Rita Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 There was a post regarding this under the AARP thread as well. I am totally disgusted over this whole thing. I never thought I would see the day that we were supposed to "snitch" on our neighbors for excersizing freedom of speech. I for one will continue to say what I feel. It is my right as an American to do so! Link to comment
ScrubbieLady Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 Well, guess what, the House "health care reform" bill has $18,000,000.00 in it for a website for healthcare professionals to report on other healthcare professionals that they feel are spending too much time and/or services on patients. Link to comment
gramma lois Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 Well, guess what, the House "health care reform" bill has $18,000,000.00 in it for a website for healthcare professionals to report on other healthcare professionals that they feel are spending too much time and/or services on patients. Holy Hannah - talk about a major shift in ethics - how sad is that? Link to comment
gramma lois Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 Good Article Cricket - Spot On! Quote: "Are we now like one of those totalitarian states? No. But we have become more collectivist. Is the move toward appointing unaccountable Czars with enormous authority, the takeover of multiple industries (corporatism), the restructuring of the economy on a socialist-command model, and the request for citizens to inform on their fellows a step closer to that ugly place? Unquestionably, the answer has to be yes. We must be concerned with the direction in which we are headed as well as the breathtaking speed." Quote: "Our forebears sacrificed so much to pass on the blessings of liberty. The least that we can do in the shadow of those heroes is to exercise our right to speak, and to do so out loud, not in whispers fearing that someone will forward our thoughts to the Watchers. These intimidating tactics must end." http://www.americanthinker.com/printpage/?...informants.html August 05, 2009 Citizen Informants By Bart Willruth Link to comment
ScrubbieLady Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 A local conservative talk show host read the entire house bill. He made pages of notes and is going through them item by item. He gives page and section number and he READS the exact verbage and then talks about it. If nothing else, why do they need a 1000 page bill to give health insurance to 15 million people. Answer, they don't, IMHO the goal is complete control of you. Health care is available now for everyone for medical necessity. If this bill passes, it will not happen. Everything they have proposed and/or passed (including the Pork and Power bill that they call a "stimulus") has led down that road. I read a congressman's comment about the health bill and he talks about "allowing" people to keep their current coverage. Allowing!?! It is none of their business where I get my healthcare or They people in government have overreached for so many years. Remember, they work for US. Not the other way around. Remind them of that fact and remember to vote in 2010. Link to comment
lunamother Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 Health care is available now for everyone for medical necessity. I'm sorry. I really really try to stay out of this type of conversation, but since I am, right now, at this minute, trying to raise $3,000 to take my husband for tests and appointments so he doesn't DIE, I must disagree with that statement, or at least amend it "health care is available now for everyone for medical necessity AND who has endless cash" oh, he must have something rare or weird, right? he has cancer, diabetes and heart issues. yup- he's a weird one. well, maybe we're trying to get care somewhere they're not equipped, so the extra charges? we've been patients at MDAnderson- the best cancer hospital in the world, for 2 years hmmm...guess we shoulda had insurance, huh? he did. worked years in pain at a terrible job to have insurance, then got fired anyway for too much time off FOR CANCER (and he never took more than 2 weeks- EVER. thru radiation and 9 major surgeries- he'd have surgery, get discharged and be at his desk THE NEXT DAY) wow. can't he get disability? yes. he was approved for disability but we didn't know (who does, till it happens?) that if you are under 62 and qualify for disability PAYMENTS, there's still a 2 year waiting period before you can get Medicare. yep- disabled people (to me, that implies 'medical attention needed') Two years is up November 1st. his graft is failing NOW. it's infected NOW. he needs scans NOW and MDAnderson told us we are self-pay in advance since we have no insurance. I told her come he** or high water I'd get the money for the appointments and scans, but what if he needs surgery NOW? what then? I was told-not by his doctor, or a nurse, or anyone with his RECORD in front of them and medical training, but from the gal in the business office- and I quote "well, he probably wouldn't DIE before November" but enough about us. we're just some of those unfortunate 'you gotta break a few eggs to make an omelet' folks- couldn't happen to anyone else- especially those smug talking heads on tv from both sides of the aisle who cluck and shake their heads and say things that imply if you don't have health insurance in America you're poor white trash or worse and just sit around with a beer in one hand and a cigarette in the other and burp in contentment knowing that the WORKING folks will take care of you. I'm seeing/getting alot of the emails out there and yes. alot of it is untrue. alot of it is geared to incite fear. being a sheeple works both ways- dig deeper PLEASE. if it's really true, forward it. if you don't have time to research it- don't. this country's already damaged enough, and there are forces out there who'd love for a total collapse who AREN'T in the government. be an American. with freedom of speech comes the responsibility to know what you're forwarding is true. you wanna know what's in the bill? you need to read it yourself. do NOT trust any politician, newscaster, or anyone but your own eyes. read it with a critical but UNBIASED eye. it's so easy to google a phrase and get the entire thing to see for yourself. and read all sides- the news stations you always watch, AND those you don't- somewhere in the middle is generally the Truth. things are being plucked out of context like- 'do you know that in the bill it says the government has access to all your personal records?' ummm....ever try to apply for medical payment plans? buy a house? a car? you have to supply all that mess 'you'll lose your choice of doctor' do you have an HMO? 'the government will redline treatments they think are unnecessary' do you have to call for pre-approval from your insurance company? THINK- then act. I'm so tired of people REacting in a knee jerk manner to forwarded emails with NO LINK, NO PROOF- just a tiny kernel of truth with alot of Spin sent off to a target population of people who will send it to 10 more, who will send it to 20 more... Is this health plan what this country needs? I dunno. but I DO know, from my own experiences, and my own talking with people I know personally and trust and who live in other countries that our system is terrible. what I DO know is that almost anywhere else in the world my husband would not be told "Pay or Die". he'd be cared for. and our people, American people, are dying every day- thousands of 'em- because of our system and the lack of care available for those who 'slip thru the cracks'. not technically poor, not rich enough to write $100,000 checks, not able to qualify for the 'high risk pool' for health insurance (we COULD get insurance for Ward thru my work- for well over $1,000 per MONTH because of his conditions- so since he COULD get his own- he doesn't qualify) *deep cleansing breath* ya'll keep discussing- I've gotta find $3,000 by Sunday- and after 7 years of the cancer dance, even when he was insured our co-pays, deductibles, non-covereds and peripherals (hotel, gas, lost wages) have cost well over $100,000 and we've cashed in every retirement account, equitied a paid-for house THREE TIMES, refinanced our 1 vehicle and sold almost everything of worth IT'S GETTING PRETTY DANG DIFFICULT TO FIND. but that's our problem. not society's. 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gramma lois Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 I am no fan of Fred Thompson - BUT this (link below) is a very interesting interview with Betsy McCaughey (Former Leutenant Governer of New York, Health Policy Expert and Patient Advocate) who has read, reread and studied the bill (1,018 pages). She states that in the context of the reduction in benefits seniors will pay for this bill with a five hundred billion cut in medicare over ten years - more than a 10% cut even when the enrollment in medicare is increasing 30%. These reductions in benefits mean, she says, fewer hip/knee replacements, bipass surgery and angioplasty the proceedures that have allowed seniors to enjoy end of life. She states that beginning at page 425 the bill begins to discuss elderly end of life care, and she goes on to state that page 430 of this bill specifies that 'counselling' includes discussion about foregoing antibiotics, nutrition, hydration... . Her concerns are that these are extreme measures that govenment should not be intruding in as these are sensitive matters for families. She goes on to say that a harsh misconception in the bill is that living longer is a burden in society, that the elderly are being scapegoated as costly to the system. She highlights a red flag statement/direct quote by one widely published government's chief health advisors - quite alarming really. One of the most frightening provisions in the bill is 'shared decision making', that is a proviso for families to share in the decision for end of life care...if families aren't at the 'counselling session' they don't get to share in the decision making. Gramma Lois: Just my two cents now - WHY SHARED DECISION MAKING IN THE FIRST PLACE??? Doctors and nurses may 'counsel' as they often do, and advice, BUT TO PROVIDE FOR FAMILES TO SHARE IN THE DECISION MAKING FOR THEIR LOVED ONES' END OF LIFE CARE??? Red flags in mho, that is unless the expert in this interview is totally of her rocker. Betsy McCaughey Interview on The Fred Thompson Show http://mliberalguy.blogspot.com/2009/08 ... -fred.html Link to Health Care Reform Bill: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-3200 lunamother you are absolutely on the target that people need to "THINK - then act" and if there is a call to act I hope people will do just that. God bless. Link to comment
gramma lois Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 SOMETHING IN THE AIR See the latest voter revolts Constituents boo, jeer as lawmakers defend Democrat health 'reform' plan Posted: August 11, 2009 9:11 pm Eastern By Chelsea Schilling © 2009 WorldNetDaily http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=106595 White House Denies Collecting Names of Opponents of Health Legislation - CNS Tuesday, August 11, 2009 By Fred Lucas, Staff Writer http://www.cnsnews.com/public/content/arti...px?RsrcID=52302 Obama to Critics: Health Reform Not About Government Takeover President Obama used a boisterous town hall in New Hampshire to address concerns and objections expressed by opponents of his health care plan. FOXNews.com Tuesday, August 11, 2009 http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/08/11/obama-hosts/ Link to comment
Cat Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 The Drudge Report this morning has a story that the reporting website has been unceremoniously dumped. But I can't click on it for the story yet. Link to comment
Crazy4Canning Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 Luna, I'm in your corner, sweetie. My family is facing a similar situation with my mom. About this 'ratting each other out' - it happened in Hitler's Germany when people said it couldn't and it can happen here as well. Even more reason to be personally protective, nice to everyone and prep like a crazy woman. Link to comment
Cat Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 The story about closing the email collection site... ~~~~~ White House disables e-tip box By MIKE ALLEN | 8/17/09 12:43 PM EDT Following a furor over how the data would be used, the White House has shut down an electronic tip box — flag@whitehouse.gov — that was set up to receive information on “fishy” claims about President Barack Obama’s health plan. E-mails to that address now bounce back with the message: “The e-mail address you just sent a message to is no longer in service. We are now accepting your feedback about health insurance reform via http://www.whitehouse.gov/realitycheck.” The “flag” service was introduced Aug. 4, with a White House blog post saying: “There is a lot of disinformation about health insurance reform out there, spanning from control of personal finances to end of life care. These rumors often travel just below the surface via chain emails or through casual conversation. Since we can’t keep track of all of them here at the White House, we’re asking for your help. If you get an email or see something on the web about health insurance reform that seems fishy, send it to flag@whitehouse.gov.” White House press secretary Robert Gibbs said at a briefing shortly after the service launched: “We're not collecting names from those e-mails. … All we're asking people to do is if they're confused about what health care reform is going to mean to them, we're happy to help clear that up for you. Nobody is keeping anybody's names.” Sen. John Cornyn (R-Texas), chairman of the National Republican Senatorial Committee, wrote a letter to Obama raising privacy concerns about what the senator called an “Obama monitoring program.” “I can only imagine the level of justifiable outrage had your predecessor asked Americans to forward e-mails critical of his policies to the White House,” Cornyn wrote. “So I urge you to cease this program immediately.” In a later statement, Cornyn said: “Of course the White House is collecting names. … It is inevitable. Anyone with access to the flag@whitehouse.gov account has access to the names and email addresses that are collected in that account. … How are they purging names and e-mail addresses from this account to protect privacy?” http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0809/26188.html Link to comment
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